This is an archive of past discussions with User:Shubinator. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
apparently works, and this is great. I was thinking maybe you could briefly summarize somewhere how should we prepare the updates for this bot. Also, later (as it could be hard to see now), how to check the bot is doing well and what to do if you're not around. Materialscientist (talk) 07:09, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I'll make a guide over the weekend. In short, though, updates can be prepared as if you had a debugged DYKadminBot; so use DYKbotdo and the credit templates as you normally would, but you shouldn't have to worry about redirects or dollar signs or that type of thing. I have noticed that your queues have a lot of random whitespace; do you know why? The bot won't find hooks if there's a difference between the credits and the hooks (that's why DYKUpdateBot didn't find the hooks for so many pages on the last run). For errors, watchlist User:DYKUpdateBot/Errors; the bot will output errors there. It's possible that the bot has died completely, and if that happens there's really no way for you to tell. The bot should update on the hour though...within 5 seconds of its target. Shubinator (talk) 07:22, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I usually try avoiding whitespaces, but I often compose preps in Wordpad and then paste the whole file into prep. Maybe this adds whitespaces. Some might be added during copy/pasting from code (windows selection "bugs"). What are the areas where whitespaces should be avoided? Materialscientist (talk) 07:28, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
Notepad might work...I know it treats newlines differently than Wordpad. The bot will edit if there is whitespace, but it might give multiple credits (like last run). So first place to check for whitespace is in credits. Second is in the article link in the hook so the bot can add the hook to the template. Shubinator (talk) 07:35, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
I don't use Windows Notepad because of multiple bugs, but routinely do macro replacements in Wordpad, e.g. replace double space with single one. This might help, or maybe wordpad still adds whitespaces upon pasting .. I'll try to check that. Materialscientist (talk) 07:39, 3 March 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for putting together this bot! I had one question — why does it sign Materialscientist's name, not its own? Nyttend (talk) 00:52, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
So that if some crap is placed on the main page, or there is a mistake with credits, then I, not he, is responsible :-). I presume bot picks up the signature of the admin who uploaded the preps to the queue, but. I support the point of placing "DYK project" instead - I sign my name only because its quick. It's the project, not the promoting admin who should be noted. Materialscientist (talk) 01:08, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
MatSci's got the main point, though it also adds a touch of personality and friendliness (a major reason why we don't have a bot welcoming new users). @MatSci The bot will take whatever is between {{DYKbotdo| and }} as the signature. My favorite is {{DYKbotdo|[[WP:Did you know|The DYK project]] ([[T:TDYK|nominate]])}}. Shubinator (talk) 04:01, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
I think I've tracked one cause for spaces. Sorry, my time zone is offset, and thus timestamps might be incorrect. [1] 13:08 UTC, after my edit "filled" the size is 9230b
[2] 22:14 UTC 5 March, Calmer Waters moved that set to prep1, size is 9346b, then at 23:58 UTC Dahn complains about spaces and trims some to 9239 (almost original).
Many editors move sets in preps. If spaces are a problem, this could (should?) be solved at the bot level. Macroreplace double spaces to single never harms anything. Materialscientist (talk) 00:10, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
I have also noticed that with using Mozilla firefox 3 the browser occasionally places (random?) white spaces that I usually have to manually correct (guessed I missed a couple that "spontaneously" formed from doing a simple cut and paste move from Prep 2 to prep 1. This from the best of my knowledge never happened while using internet explorer. Also, when previewing the section the white spacing does not appear until after the save. At least that is my observation. More specifically, when I make a small change to a hook that appears formatted correctly, it occasionally opens with multiple instances of white spacing that do not show spacing errors at preview. Well my 2 cents CalmerWaters03:03, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
It is "nobody's" fault (be it people or browsers). IE has many other glitches. I know one (very diligent and pedantic in other respects) user who typically adds 1k whitespaces per full-length article per edit. My point was that it is inevitable and DYK update (bot or manual) should be prepared to deal with that. Materialscientist (talk) 03:31, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
Ok, I've changed the code so the bot removes the extra spaces before parsing it. (I still think it's odd that programs are adding spaces while cutting & pasting...I use Firefox and don't have that issue.) Shubinator (talk) 03:53, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
(i) Thinking again, won't it (very rarely) break link to images which contain double space in their names (as _ _ symbols, e.g. - not sure it is possible, but saw all kind of weird image names) (ii) Many spaces originate from T:TDYK and then merely copy/pasted into preps (tracked some). Materialscientist (talk) 04:16, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
(i) I just tried to upload the current DYK image as "Galileo 31I.png" (with two spaces), and I got an upload warning: File name has been changed to "Galileo_31I.png". So I think it's impossible. (ii) As far as I know, mediawiki (the software that wikipedia runs on) treats multiple spaces as single spaces, so I don't think there's any loss of information. Shubinator (talk) 04:30, 7 March 2010 (UTC)
I just edited DYK [3] to remove any double spaces, using wikEd's search-and-replace function. I suspect wikEd is introducing some of the extra spaces; note that I actually introduced extra spaces in the blank newDYKnom template, which I had to paste back in.
That's interesting. Before I thought the double spaces might be caused by newlines being converted to spaces, but that's not it...I've seen some with four or five spaces. Whatever it is, the bot will turn the multiple spaces back into single spaces before it hits the Main Page. Shubinator (talk) 13:45, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
I've finally crawled to that page and looked it through. Well done. Comments/questions (not urgent at all):
I believe posting a message at ANI (when there no update available) is not necessary. Most editors who can produce an update watch WT:DYK, and ANI regulars might well be unfamiliar with the update process. It is safer to keep a previous DYK set for >6 hrs than put something inappropriate instead.
If there is a sign of malfunctioning of some other toolserver processes, can we know whether the DYKUpdateBot is operational?
How does the bot handle edit conflicts (rare, but can occur while tagging)?
How about ' sign, do we need to replace it with {{'}}?
Can the bot track "|right" (and remove or alert) in the image line? Also check if 100x100px is absent and alert, but not take action - I sometimes widen it to 120x100px ;-)
At the moment DYKUpdateBot is running on a server I have access to. I'm waiting for the Toolserver request to be approved. Once it's on the Toolserver I'll see if I can make a status display. Really the best status check is to look at its contribs.
Right now it doesn't handle edit conflicts. The bot will hang indefinitely if an edit conflict occurs. I'll add in edit confict checks soon. (In the meantime it's unlikely the bot will edit conflict since it edits a page within a second of reading it.)
Why that note: while issuing credits I had edits conflicts not once. I was first opening user talks in 8+ windows and then quick pasting the article name and hitting enter, thus my delay was longer than a few seconds, but still seconds. Materialscientist (talk) 04:07, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
Well, that's because you're adding a new section. It's impossible to edit conflict if you're creating a new section. The bot isn't using the same interface in the API, so it might be possible for the bot to edit conflict where we can't. I'll test the edit conflicts to see where we need the checks. Shubinator (talk) 04:34, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
I might have been unclear above - I did have edit conflicts more than once - on creating, deleting or editing a sub-section, which other editors didn't touch at all. Don't know the mechanisms behind. Materialscientist (talk) 06:21, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
That's interesting. I'll see if I can fiddle around with it tomorrow. I just updated the code for the bot (too sleepy to post the updates to /Code now) so the server lag doesn't affect it. Shubinator (talk) 06:24, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
' is also seen as a normal character, so you don't need to use {{'}}. You'll probably need to use it to format the hooks correctly though (for example, '''[[John Doe]]''''s should be '''[[John Doe]]'''{{'}}s).
ANI posting removed, with WT:DYK posting still at 2 hours.
Bot will post to /Errors if it sees |right or doesn't see 100x100px in the image wikitext. I'll update /Manual in a bit; /Code is updated. Shubinator (talk) 16:28, 12 March 2010 (UTC)
I just saw the Main Page today (don't always pay attention to it), and noticed that Icos was apparently featured yesterday! My congrats as well. JamieS93❤21:43, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
Oh man! I had company over during the week that included March 13, so I wasn't at the computer much and thus didn't notice the TFA! (Although I may have missed it even without that alibi, as I don't often check the main page.) Belated congratulations! rʨanaɢ (talk) 02:36, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
Thanks :) I also don't see the Main Page much. I told the photographer of the TFA image about it, and they were very excited. Shubinator (talk) 05:48, 22 March 2010 (UTC)
Could you write a javascript tool for nominating articles to dyk? It would have a simple form interface... Just a request, feel free to respond.Smallman12q (talk) 13:21, 16 March 2010 (UTC)
I'll be very busy in the next few months, so I don't think I'll have time to write another tool. Also, I don't see a real need; the template and instructions are fairly clear already. Shubinator (talk) 04:20, 18 March 2010 (UTC)
It's a classic case of a yoyo-ing page. In November and December 2008, the article was much larger. The script uses a binary search algorithm to figure out the 1x revision, so when it saw those revisions in late 2008, it thought that the 1x point must be before. It's a known bug; that's why "always" is highlighted in red on the script documentation. Shubinator (talk) 04:38, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Special symbols in template DYKmake
DYK credit Code *{{DYKmake|Benjamin Robbins Curtis|7&6=thirteen}} looks bad on a page, because of username 7&6=thirteen. Straight to the point: what should we do with such credits? For now I simply removed it from queue and will issue manually. Materialscientist (talk) 07:28, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
The problem is having an equals sign in it. *{{DYKmake|Benjamin Robbins Curtis|7&6{{=}}thirteen}} works fine. rʨanaɢ (talk) 14:59, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
Rjanag's half right. The problem is the equals sign, but I think Rjanag's solution to make Medawiki happy will not make the bot happy. I'll see if I can tweak the code over the weekend; until then leave these types of credits as-is or do them manually. Shubinator (talk) 05:32, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
Ok, the bot will now expand templates it sees in the user portion of the DYKmake or DYKnom credits. So *{{DYKmake|Benjamin Robbins Curtis|7&6{{=}}thirteen}} is valid and won't crash the bot. (For the record, the bot wouldn't have crashed with the original credit and still won't.) I've only done this for the user portion though; let me know if you also want the bot to expand templates it sees in the title portion of the credits. Shubinator (talk) 05:48, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
Great. I hope the bot will also handle &ndash code in this credit {{DYKmake|1922–23 Nelson F.C. season|BigDom}} which is now in Queue3 (&ndash operator is seen as dash symbol here; see the actual code; I don't remeber whether we had such credits before). Materialscientist (talk) 06:01, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
Actually it's throwing a fit now. It might take a few minutes to debug; you could do the update yourself if you want. I think it's the new login system; it must've changed more than I thought. Shubinator (talk) 06:04, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
I might be wrong, but I think the bot crashed exactly on that &ndash (and I forgot to check the queue count and went manual on the next update - this is normal when I'm tired :) To give another clue, in
Yeah, it is the ndash. I restarted the bot (it was hanging before, so it wouldn't have done the last update anyways.) I'll look into the ndash later, probably next weekend. Shubinator (talk) 15:36, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
I think I've solved the issue of HTML encoding in credits. I'll update the running code tomorrow or the day after; I'll be going to sleep soon and I like to be around for the first run after a code update in case something happens. /Code is updated. Shubinator (talk) 05:04, 22 April 2010 (UTC)
Running code updated. By the way, the bot didn't tag MovieLens because the ArticleHistory didn't have a currentstatus parameter, and the bot uses that parameter to figure out where to put the dykdate parameter, so it couldn't continue. Shubinator (talk) 00:01, 24 April 2010 (UTC)
DYK frequency
We need to go back to an 8-hour cycle. What pages have to be edited to do that now? It's many months since I had to do this and I'm not sure if there are changes because of the new bot. Gatoclass (talk) 16:38, 22 April 2010 (UTC)
