User talk:North Shoreman

Archive 1 Archive 2 Archive 3 Archive 4

Whig Party vandal

Tom, I've reverted the Whig Party vandal again, and left a fourth-level warning. Since this is apparently a static IP, I'll pursue a long-term block if they do it again. Thanks. - BilCat (talk)

I posted right references

What do you want from me?come to 30 years war Talk.82.49.34.193 (talk) 18:42, 24 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

My issue is that the text added is too poorly written to communicate useful information to a reader. Others have problems with your interpretation of the sources. First, I want you to stop reverting other editors -- at least four editors disagree with your text. Next I want is for you to discuss on the article's discussion page exactly what you're trying to say and specifically show what language in the sources support your conclusions. Finally, don't add anything back until there is a clear consensus of editors to do this. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 18:55, 24 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Ernio48

Is reverting main references .79.49.192.139 (talk) 19:28, 24 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I asked you to stop reverting other editors without consensus -- you obviously refused. What's the point in attempting to communicate further with you? Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 19:33, 24 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Sojourner-Truths name.

Update: After reading Wikipedia guidelines I am currently attempting to find a mentor. When I have a Mentor, I look forward to posting a few articles which may be of interest to Wikipedia readers. I have set up the Wikipedia account, and user talk page. MikeWilkins (talk) 07:04, 1 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, Next week when I have more time I will forward important information on Sojourner-Truths name. I will also attempt to learn the method required by Wikipedia. It looks like I need to insert all points of reference. Thank you and best regards. Mike Wilkins.MikeWilkins (talk) 02:10, 26 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Discussion at User talk:Tim1965#Homestead strike

 You are invited to join the discussion at User talk:Tim1965#Homestead strike. —usernamekiran(talk) 17:50, 7 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

User group for Military Historians

Greetings,

"Military history" is one of the most important subjects when speak of sum of all human knowledge. To support contributors interested in the area over various language Wikipedias, we intend to form a user group. It also provides a platform to share the best practices between military historians, and various military related projects on Wikipedias. An initial discussion was has been done between the coordinators and members of WikiProject Military History on English Wikipedia. Now this discussion has been taken to Meta-Wiki. Contributors intrested in the area of military history are requested to share their feedback and give suggestions at Talk:Discussion to incubate a user group for Wikipedia Military Historians.

MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 11:30, 21 December 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Leo Frank abduction

Hi Tom, I came across this edit request in the talk page for Leo Frank and am wondering if you know where this text (paragraph 2 of Abduction and lynching) was sourced from. I see Dinnerstein mentions 175 miles, and Frey mentions seven cars (rather than eight) went to Milledgeville, but I don't see one source for everything in the related text, nor do I see it in the sources mentioned later in the paragraph. Tonystewart14 (talk) 06:10, 7 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Photo request

Since your residence is "on the Ohio side of Lake Erie in the western suburbs of Cleveland", would you be willing to help me with an Ohio-related project? For 3 years, I've been working on getting illustrations of all municipalities and townships statewide, and as you can see from my project-tracking page, User:Nyttend/Ohio, the only counties with unillustrated locations are in the Western Reserve. If you have a camera good enough to take simple pictures (e.g. countryside for a rural township, a residential neighborhood for a community, a city downtown), that's all I'm asking. If you'd like to help but you have questions, please let me know. Nyttend (talk) 23:09, 22 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Andrew Jackson

we are very close to getting Andrew Jackson promoted to featured article. We have worked together in the past on a couple of presidential articles and I thought you might like to take a look at the FA review and see if you believe it is worthy of supporting for promotion. Thanks. Hoppyh (talk) 12:24, 26 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Italians lynched in New Orleans

As I recall, you have made contributions on articles on lynching. There is discussion going on at Talk:March 14, 1891, lynchings because some editors want to refer to other events, such as the Chinese massacre of 1871 in LA, to say that the New Orleans event was not "the largest mass lynching in US history." I think this is an inappropriate classification of deaths in race riots as lynchings (because people were hanged) and tried to point out the difference between race riots (which the 1871 LA event was) and lynchings. Perhaps you could add perspective, as well? Parkwells (talk) 21:51, 3 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

UDC Page

As a historian pursuing a PhD degree, I’m rather concerned by the reliance on secondary sources. I understand that may be acceptable to Eiki but shouldn’t a higher standard be held?

If we are going to call an organization all these terrible things, shouldn’t we be using their words to confirm it? Ed Sebesta for instance is a well know historical hit man, yet we are using his word as a source authority.

As I have been working on my degree I have been distressed by the politicization I have seen in my discipline. Historians don’t want to simply record events anymore. They (we) want to be activists, place modern motivations on long dead people and get our 15 minutes of fame. The sources quoted in this article fit this discription too well. In other words, I see a whole lot of opinion but little to no primary evidence based fact.

To conclude, I really think all the opinion needs to be removed and a simple recording of fact be placed instead.

Thank you. Thalomen1 (talk) 00:18, 10 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia is not a research paper - it's an encyclopedia, a tertiary source. And such a source relies primarily on secondary sources.Volunteer Marek (talk) 00:41, 10 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thats disapointing

An encyclopedia is supposed to be a trusted source, based on both primary and secondary dart sources. Forgive me but your explanation doesn’t make sense to me.

If wikipedia not going to be as reliable and fact based as we can make it, why bother? The UDC page is not a reliable source and has much more in common with a trash hit piece. Honestly, it seems to me if that’s the stNdard it’s setting itself up to nothing more than biased, unreliable, opinion based pulp. Or at least the digital version of pulp. Shouldn’t we set a higher standard?

If what your saying is accurate, and secondary sources are all that matter, Wikipedia is about the worst source of information imaginable. Thalomen1 (talk) 01:02, 10 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I provided you with useful links that you should spend some time with before trying to make further edits. This link (WP:WPNOTRS) is the most relevant to your comments. It clearly states, "Wikipedia articles should be based mainly on reliable secondary sources, i.e., a document or recording that relates or discusses information originally presented elsewhere." It also states, "Primary sources are often difficult to use appropriately. Although they can be both reliable and useful in certain situations, they must be used with caution in order to avoid original research." Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 01:16, 10 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Tom, Thanks! I did look through them and I just find myself stunned. I appreciate you sending the information, Im just saying I find Wikipedia's definition of "reliable sources" highly questionable and extremely subjective. I don't know many people who consider Ed Sebesta reliable. The man is a hack of the worst sort. Yet he's given authoritative status on several Wikipedia pages. At any rate, Im not going to try to make wiki something it isn't. Im just rather disillusioned with wikipedia. Thanks again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Thalomen1 (talk • contribs) 01:29, 10 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Have you reviewed this edit to Secession in the United States?

I've been keeping an eye on a particular editor, and this recent, large edit of theirs, to an article with which I have little familiarity (but whose talk page you have recently edited) is one that I cannot evaluate. I am also confounded as to the intent of the editor's recent edits, which have been reverted. All I'm asking is that some other eyes look the edit over. Thanks--Quisqualis (talk) 21:08, 10 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Andrew Johnson

Are you aware the quote is no longer in the article? I was surprised. deisenbe (talk) 21:12, 29 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Precious

battle of vandalism

Thank you for quality articles for the American Revolutionary War task force, such as Nullification Crisis, Thomas Caute Reynolds and Peace Conference of 1861, for adding substantially to articles such as Slavery in the United States, for fighting POV, vandalism and nonsense from 2007, - Tom, you are an awesome Wikipedian!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:54, 1 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

A year ago, you were recipient no. 1990 of Precious, a prize of QAI! --Gerda Arendt (talk) 06:57, 1 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

My Bonnie Lies Over the Ocean

The edit I contributed to this page is the most common version of the song I've heard. I think the page is incomplete without it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.225.32.71 (talk) 22:48, 12 September 2018 (UTC)[reply]

1792 Election Washington Being A Federalist

In 1792 Washington Ran For Re-Election As A Federalist And Won But In 1788 He Ran As Independent And Won Jed Mek 25 (talk) 22:14, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Source? Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 22:22, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

If You Litteraly Search In Wikepidia Federalist Party And Look In Elections It Shows You That In 1792 George Washington Was A Federalist Jed Mek 25 (talk) 22:36, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Reply on the article discussion page. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 22:38, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I’m Sorry I mean in Electoral History In The Federalist Party Wikepidia Jed Mek 25 (talk) 22:48, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Again, reply on the article discussion page for the article. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 22:50, 29 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

History of African Americans in Los Angeles

Your attention is called to the deficiencies called out in the note above an article upon which you have either worked or left a comment during the past two years. You are invited to correct those deficiencies if you can possible do so. Otherwise, the article may be deleted or severely truncated. The article is History of African Americans in Los Angeles. Sincerely, BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 15:19, 30 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I see I edited the article once almost two years ago. Thanks for your interest, however. I will add the article to my watchlist, but I doubt I'll do much more than contribute to discussions if they arise. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 15:44, 30 October 2018 (UTC)[reply]

A goat for you!

good goats are for good wikipedia users

Boomom99 (talk) 14:40, 3 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Thayeri kingsnake article

The correct way of writing the snake subspecies' common name is Thayer's kingsnake. It's even mentioned as such in the References.

Therefore, I don't think that I'm vandalizing the article, merely fixing it to what it should be.2600:1700:7E31:5710:DCB5:7FA1:EE89:FE7E (talk) 00:09, 17 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I'll take you at face value -- thanks for correcting me. Realize, though, that the best thing to do is change the title of the article. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 00:14, 17 December 2018 (UTC)[reply]

You've got mail

Hello, North Shoreman. Please check your email; you've got mail!
It may take a few minutes from the time the email is sent for it to show up in your inbox. You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{You've got mail}} or {{ygm}} template. Dr. Joseph rodgawskiti 00:51, 12 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Dear North Shoreman, I noticed you changed some of my articles please check your email at you earliest convenience and email me back.

Dr. Joseph Rodgawskiti

I replied on your talk page. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 01:45, 12 January 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Teapot Dome scandal

FWIW, I think you were the fifth editor to revert, not the third. This edit war has been persistent and long lived. 7&6=thirteen (☎) 10:34, 30 April 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Some baklava for you!

thank you for an edit that restored my work because you said it was more clear and concise! <3 Stridersword (talk) 20:35, 5 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Another Hitler comparison

Dear North Shoreman,

I thought you might be interested to know that someone is making another "Hitler killed people therefore anything he says is relevant anywhere" argument on Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Alpine_race#Adolf_Hitler%27s_opinions_on_Mussolini_are_meaningless_and_should_be_removed

Have a nice day - Hunan201p (talk) 07:21, 22 August 2019 (UTC)[reply]

The Federalist and Whig Parties

My contribution wasn’t vandalism or meant to be “disruptive” or “unconstructive”. It is common knowledge within the community of historians of the American party system that the Whig Party is also (at the very least in part or indirectly, though many would dispute such a minimal characterization) descended from the Federalist Party as well as the National Republican and Anti-Masonic parties, just as the Republican Party is largely descended from the Whigs. In fact, it is through the Whigs that the G.O.P. is declared an “indirect descendant” of the Federalists by renowned historians such as Edward J. Larson as well as social and political scientists such as Seymour Martin Lipset. You should look at the sources provided in relevant articles on this site. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.134.33.163 (talk) 06:25, 12 September 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Please comment on Talk:Normani

The feedback request service is asking for participation in this request for comment on Talk:Normani. Legobot (talk) 04:23, 16 October 2019 (UTC)[reply]

2019 US Banknote Contest

	US Banknote Contest
	November-December 2019
There are an estimated 30,000 different varieties of United States banknotes, yet only a fraction of these are represented on Wikimedia Commons in the form of 2D scans. Additionally, Colonial America, the Confederate States, the Republic of Texas, multiple states and territories, communities, and private companies have issued banknotes that are in the public domain today but are absent from Commons. In the months of November and December, WikiProject Numismatics will be running a cross-wiki upload-a-thon, the 2019 US Banknote Contest. The goal of the contest is to increase the number of US banknote images available to content creators on all Wikimedia projects. Participants will claim points for uploading and importing 2D scans of US banknotes, and at the end of the contest all will receive awards. Whether you want to claim the Gold Wiki or you just want to have fun, all are invited to participate. If you do not want to receive invitations to future US Banknote Contests, follow the instructions here

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Please comment on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Maps

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ArbCom 2019 election voter message

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Please comment on Talk:Battle of Dak To

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Battle of Belmont

Hi, my minor alteration of the summary table of the Battle of Belmont article was incorrectly reversed by you for no reason given. My minor edit changed the incorrect summary that the Battle of Belmont was a "Union victory", when it in fact was not and no book I've read has ever made that claim. The south claimed victory and the northern press 'lamented defeat' in the aftermath of Brig Gen Grant's retreat back to Cairo. It actually explains why it was a Confederate victory in the last part of the article. I'm not sure why you insist it was a Union victory as the source that was linked is now dead and no longer active, when the battle resulted in no loss of territory held by the occupation force of General Polk. It's like claiming that the Confederates won the Battle of Shiloh because on the first day they took most of the Union positions but that ignores the events that followed in which a counterattack resulted in defeat. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Futurefilmmaker (talk • contribs) 18:54, 20 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Copied the above to the article's talk page for discussion. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 16:44, 21 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Happy New Year North Shoreman!

Happy New Year!

Hello North Shoreman:
Thanks for all of your contributions to improve the encyclopedia for Wikipedia's readers, and have a happy and enjoyable New Year! Cheers, Donner60 (talk) 23:18, 27 December 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Send New Year cheer by adding {{subst:Happy New Year fireworks (static)}} to user talk pages with a friendly message.

Stephen Girard

The First Bank of the US article should not suggest uncertainty about the name of Girard's bank that did not exist. Girard was a banker who, unusually for the time, did business under his own name. Here's a check drawn on the bank during his lifetime. People called the bank Girard's bank in conversation because that's what it was, but there was no uncertainty about the actual name. 73.71.251.64 (talk) 23:17, 13 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moved to article talk page and responded there. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 23:21, 13 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Why do you keep suppressing discussion at 'McCarthyism?'

Why do you keep suppressing discussion at 'McCarthyism?' Please note that if you are attempting to suppress freedom of speech in order to influence the outcome of elections, you could be charged at some future date with treason.--171.33.197.192 (talk) 16:56, 16 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Note -- Above IP has now been blocked for their antisemitic posts at the McCarthyism discussion page.Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 17:03, 16 January 2020 (UTC)[reply]

About Lend-Lease

If you want to believe an idiot, I can't stop you from doing it. I'm only interested in one thing that makes you believe an idiot (Sokolov). — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.155.64.26 (talk) 13:39, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Please tell me about "Weeks 2004". What is it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.155.64.26 (talk) 14:35, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Moved discussion to article's talk page. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 14:50, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your explanation. It's nice to communicate with people who are ready to help. I will now know about quoting. Thank you also for prompting to read this book. A bit even funny, that the only (!!!!!) the "historian" whom he quotes is Sokolov. Here's superhistory. :) Россиянин2019 (talk) 19:41, 10 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry

Sorry about my shameful edits, I will make constructive contributions next time. 71.184.142.128 (talk) 00:13, 14 February 2020 (UTC)

I disagree

Hello, You recently removed by edit to the Midwestern United States page for being "unconstructive". I do not think this is the case. At its current state the article makes it seem like all of Illinois is a Democrat state, while actually very few counties are Democrat. I just feel as an Illinoisian it is my duty to point out that there is more to my home state than just Chicago.

108.69.178.124 (talk) 22:39, 27 February 2020 (UTC) A concerned Illinoisian[reply]

I replied on the article's talk page. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 22:45, 27 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

March Madness 2020

G'day all, March Madness 2020 is about to get underway, and there is bling aplenty for those who want to get stuck into the backlog by way of tagging, assessing, updating, adding or improving resources and creating articles. If you haven't already signed up to participate, why not? The more the merrier! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 08:19, 29 February 2020 (UTC) for the coord team[reply]

Mary Phagan murder notes

Hi Tom, I'm curious if you remember what Osborn meant in this section when he says that the notes were written in the third person rather than the first. As an IP in the talk page mentions, it seems to be in the first person. If you're not sure, do you have any objection to it being removed, maybe substituted with a mention of Henry Alexander? Tonystewart14 (talk) 00:10, 8 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Underground Railroad

It's not an event. A factor, but not an event. it has to have a date if it's an event. deisenbe (talk) 12:25, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I've addressed this at the template talk page. Tom (North Shoreman) (talk) 12:27, 12 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Feedback request: Biographies request for comment

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Precious anniversary

Precious

Two years!

--Gerda Arendt (talk) 07:24, 1 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Feedback request: Biographies request for comment

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Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nominations open

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Debate over mercenaries and belligerents

Hello North Shoreman. I was looking through the edit history in the American Revolutionary War article, (and Talk page) and noticed that you were once quite involved in the debates. Currently we are debating whether we should refer to the Hessians as mercenaries or auxiliaries. The discussions start here and continue here. Any opinions and insights you can offer are welcomed. -- Gwillhickers (talk) 23:49, 12 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

You might also be interested in a merge proposal taking place here. -- Gwillhickers (talk) 23:59, 12 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Milhist coordinator election voting has commenced

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Request for Admin: assist to reconcile three project ratings

Any assist on your part, or a referral to an Admin with a possible interest, would be appreciated, viz.: American Revolutionary War is rated variously across three related projects: (1) B-class, Top-importance at WikiProject American Revolutionary War; (2) Start-class at WikiProject Military History, demoted from C-class anonymously after an upgrade request from C-class. (3) C-class, Low-importance by Wikipedia Version 1.0 Editorial Team/ v0.5.

- The ARW page had an average daily pageview of 5,761 for the year-to-date 10/09/2019 last year, increased to 7,020 this year-to-date, with spikes July 4th at 31,000 and 66,000 respectively. The PAGE VIEW status shows the Start-class from a Project without an importance rating for the article, NOT the B-class from seven projects rating it Top-, High- and Mid-importance. - TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 19:44, 10 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

ARW article progress, Apr-Oct 2020

Although each of the two principal editors over the past eight months, TheVirginiaHistorian and Gwillhickers, are qualified to rate the article B-status, we seek ‘another set of eyes’ to confirm our progress and suggest avenues of further improvement before applying for a ‘Good Article’ review among the nine WikiProjects following the article.

B1. Suitably referenced and cited. All paragraphs end with a citation; all direct quotes are attributed; All 588 citations now conform to HarvRef format. Redundant footnotes at each cite have been removed, over 45 items. Oldest redundant references, usually from the early 1900s without footnotes elsewhere, are moved to “Further reading”. REMOVED vandal footnotes referencing nonsense, Apple-apps, et al, & WP:blocked Lulu-published works, identified self-published websites for future Talk-page removal. B3. Defined structure with a lead section. The lead section is reduced to five paragraphs of summary material from the article. The body is reorganized into six topically focused sections, with half the previous TOC sections. B4. Free from grammatical errors.

B2. Reasonably covers the topic. Article top hat: "This article is about military actions primarily." Narrative trimmed over 15% to “readable prose size” by using copyedits and three substantial moves of text-footnote-references to wp:Talks at Diplomacy in the American Revolutionary War, Intelligence in the American Revolutionary War, and British Army during the American Revolutionary War. To accommodate contributors, much detail is maintained in article “Notes” with a HUGE Kb count in an effort to stabilize the article, avoid edit wars, and slow the additions of Talk sections. * also see ARTICLE ISSUES paragraph below *.

- ARTICLE SCOPE is taken from two Jimbo criteria for wp:editor consensus at wp:due weight, for ARW and sister articles: (1) Britannica, one of the “commonly accepted reference texts” here, and

- (2) PROMINENT ADHERENTS for the American Revolution as a civil-war-rebellion among British subjects in North America, with peace made exclusively between them at the Anglo-American 1783 Peace of Paris. These include thirteen (13) distinguished scholars recognized by the History Pulitzer Commission: Bernard Bailyn 1968, Daniel Boorstin 1974, John J. Ellis 2000, Robert Middlekauff 1983, Forrest McDonald 1986, Richard White* 1992, Gordon S. Wood 1993, Lance Banning 1996, Jack Rakove 1997, Joseph J. Ellis 2001, Daniel Richter* 2002, David Hackett Fischer 2005, and lastly Larrie D. Ferreiro* 2007, who is sometimes misinterpreted by wp:editors. :: * - finalists. - TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 19:44, 10 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

ARW new images

B5. NEW Supporting infobox and images. Our collaboration at wp:Graphics Lab/Photography workshop published a NEW COLLAGE at Infobox, three images related to the article Top-hat “about military actions primarily”. NEW PORTRAITS: two of the three British CiCs in America; War Chief-Colonels with regular British & US commissions; Mississippi R. conquerors with independent commands: Spanish General Galvez and Virginia Colonel Clark. NEW MAPS: North American Indian tribes & languages; British and Spanish claims, French cessions immediately prior; King’s Proclamation Line and parallel Indian Treaties; NEW SECTION American Logistics & landing scene.

- NEW BALANCE. pro-British political image; state-house and 1st Continental Congress scenes; American victory in South scene; British fleet Hudson scene; French-gifted USN ship; Dutch credit in caption at HMS Serapis scene; French fleet at Newport RI; British at Charleston; Galvez with Spanish at Pensacola; (first-last) USS Alliance image; pair portraits for Vergennes of ancient regime & Lafayette of Enlightenment French; Ms. Hart captures 6 British infantry; pair portraits of British Tory-Am-war & Whig-Am-peace Prime Ministers; George III in Speech from the Throne robes for American independence, peace and trade.

- NEW SUB-SECTIONS. British off India; British off Saintes, Caribbean; British defense of Gibraltar scene. AFTERMATH, Territory section: paired portraits of of Jay for evacuating British forts & US Gen. Wilkinson for a Spanish agent; scene of Revolutionary graves with mass grave at Saratoga. - TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 19:44, 10 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Unresolved article issues

(1) Nature of the American War: At Military History Project, reviewer deprecated article for Infobox not restricting participants to “Belligerents” of nation-states declaring war, as at War of the Austrian Succession. Reviewer an others at that Project Talk would not entertain parallel between ARW and Spanish Civil War “combatants”. In the ARW, besides belligerents and co-belligerent nation-states with declarations of war, page editors argued to include additional combatants: American Indian tribes on both sides, American-side state militias, British-side “Hessians”.

- (2) Scope of the American War, wp:editors have advanced a "Global American Revolutionary War" that by their POV historiography, takes place after October 1781 Yorktown, and is prosecuted without Congress knowledge, consent, or participation of its commissioned officers; but beyond Congress co-belligerents overlap with the ARW. Theirs is a "Global-ARW" extended in not merely by timeline overlap, but supposedly by a documented "spread" --- after no American replacements for regiments ending their enlistment, furloughing all Continental regiments home without pay, selling off or gifting US Navy ships for past-due Congressional debt, and Anglo-American Preliminary Peace. "End of the ARW" all hinges on Absolute Euro monarchs making peace with Britain, formally at the Versailles Palace outside Paris; them alone by diplomacy in an overseas palace, without Congress or Parliament, with Anglo-American peace terms agreed to and unanimously ratified by Congress 15 April 1782, without a shooting war in progress anywhere in America.

- But there was war prosecuted against Britain by France and Spain after June 1779 under the Bourbon Family Pact and their Aranjuez Convention, Articles 5 & 7 for imperial expansion at British expense. These war aims were pursued at odds with the treaty terms of the Franco-American 1778 Treaty of Alliance, Art. 8 that provided for ending war against Britain at "tacit" British acknowledgement of American independence. Mahon 1890 calls the second war against Britain by Euro great powers as the "Bourbon War of 1778", but the term does not seem to be currently fashionable. - TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 19:44, 10 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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RfC - scope and title for the American Revolutionary War article

I am forwarding this RfC notice to you, along with the ongoing Discussion Summary Chart because you are listed as a Military Project member interested in the American Revolutionary War. The RfC and discussion is found at Talk:American Revolutionary War. Please feel free to delete this notice if it does not fit your current interests. - TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 23:28, 5 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

American Revolutionary War, which is within the scope of this WikiProject, has an RFC for value. A discussion is taking place. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments on the discussion page. Thank you. TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 23:23, 4 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Which of two (2) titles should be chosen to define the scope of the existing article American Revolutionary War?
discussion summarized by TheVirginiaHistorian (talk) 23:28, 5 December 2020 (UTC)[reply]

A. "American Revolutionary War”

B. "War of the American Revolution"

- continuity - used at this WP article and sisters for 19 years - scope - British-American insurrection in continental North America - participants British & US Congress with their respective allies, auxiliaries & combatants - war aims -- Brit: maintain First British Empire with mercantile system -- US: independence, British evacuation, territory to Mississippi-navigation, Newfoundland-fish & cure - results - US independence & republic; Britain the biggest US trade partner & finances US expanding business & Treasury - reliable scholarly reference Britannica for the general reader - prominent adherents - 15 Pulitzer history winners

- modern update - uses 'vast majority of sources' found in a browser search - scope - British-American insurrection in continental North America, Anglo-Bourbon (Fr.&Sp.) War-across worldwide empires, Fourth Anglo-Dutch War-North Atlantic, Second Mysore War-Indian subcontinent & Ocean - participants British & US Congress, France, Spain, Dutch Republic, Kingdom of Mysore - war aims -- Brit: maintain First British Empire with mercantile system -- US independence, British evacuation, territory to Mississippi-navigation, Newfoundland-fish & cure -- Bourbons: Gibraltar, Jamaica, Majorca, expand Gambia trade, expand India trade -- Dutch - free trade with North America & Caribbean -- Mysore wider east-Indian sub-continent sphere of influenced results - Second British Empire, Spanish Majorca, French Gambia, further decline of Dutch Republic - reliable scholarly reference [world military dictionary] for the military specialist - prominent adherents - Michael Clodfelter, more to follow

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