User talk:Duncan.Hull/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Archive 2

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Ontologies

Hi. In reply to your wonderings at CFD#Category:SciFoo attendees: Here's a small part of the context, according to my very limited understanding... :)

1. Best summed up by the intro at WP:Overcategorization, and the subheadings with 3-examples-each that follow.
2. Our WP:Category system is far from perfect, and that is partially because everyone has a different ideal size and usage for it. Some want only fundamental characteristics, others want every single keyword/tag that could possibly be associated with a topic (a freely added tag-based folksonomy. (Here's a somewhat related blog post I read yesterday, that might work here in a few years?))
3. The more complex it gets, the harder it is to manage. So keeping the system smaller has pragmatic premises.
4. And then the whole thing veers into arguments over ontology, which Italian Wikinews covers nicely in its recent interview with Umberto Eco (search for "onto" in page)
5. Lists really can be better when additional context can be included, like with the List of TED speakers. See what other people have written about that idea, at WP:Categories, lists, and navigation templates.

And probably all sorts of other factors! I've managed to avoid learning too much about categories here.

Sorry for the ramble, but whilst I was contemplating it, I thought I should share. Also, I like your blog :) -- Quiddity (talk) 03:08, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

Accomplishment by a Senior Scientist Award

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April 2011

Welcome to Wikipedia. Everyone is welcome to contribute to the encyclopedia, but when you add or change content, as you did to the article Aaron Klug, please cite a reliable source for the content of your edit. This helps maintain our policy of verifiability. See Wikipedia:Citing sources for how to cite sources, and the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia. Thank you. GcSwRhIc (talk) 19:55, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Hello, verifiability is on the category page, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:EMBO_members see http://www.embo.org/embo-members

Each article needs to mention the membership with a reference. Don't just add categories to biographies without corresponding information in the article. Thanks. GcSwRhIc (talk) 20:13, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Invitation to take part in a pilot study

I am a Wikipedian, who is studying the phenomenon on Wikipedia. I need your help to conduct my research on about understanding "Motivation of Wikipedia contributors." I would like to invite you to a short survey. Please give me your valuable time, which estimates only 5 minutes. cooldenny (talk) 20:04, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Please do not add or change content without verifying it by citing reliable sources, as you did to César Milstein. Before making any potentially controversial edits, it is recommended that you discuss them first on the article's talk page. Please review the guidelines at Wikipedia:Citing sources and take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. Do not add categories, if there is no mention of it in the article. Thank you. GcSwRhIc (talk) 20:31, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Please do not add unsourced content, as you did to Bruce Alberts. This contravenes Wikipedia's policy on verifiability. If you continue to do so, you may be blocked from editing Wikipedia. Take the time to add one sentence to the article with a reference before you add a category. Thank you. GcSwRhIc (talk) 21:17, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

OK, I'm adding new entries as e.g. Peer Bork ‎ [1] see [.| source].

No, you are not. There is still no mention of EMBO in 'the article. Putting a link in the edit summary is not referencing something. Please see Wikipedia:Citing sources. Before adding the category add a sentence to the article stating that the subject is a member of 'Organization X' with a reference. You are adding it to lots of articles so it should be easy for you to copy and paste something that you could tweek each time. Thanks. GcSwRhIc (talk) 23:36, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

so what would you suggest then? I figure that http://www.embo.org is a verifiable and reputable source but they don't give me links to individual member pages. Can't see what else I can do, other than leave the information out altogether.

Heres an example of a similar sort of edit [2] the added content is in red. for the Nobel laureates use http://www.embo.org/embo-members/find-a-member/nobel-laureates.html use the general search page for the other members. Use Template:Cite web inside <ref></ref> would be best, but if you at least put the link inside ref tags. GcSwRhIc (talk) 23:54, 14 April 2011 (UTC)

Categories for discussion nomination of Category:EMBO members

Category:EMBO members, which you created, has been nominated for discussion. If you would like to participate in the discussion, you are invited to add your comments at the category's entry on the Categories for discussion page. Thank you. Pichpich (talk) 23:03, 18 April 2011 (UTC)

OK, ta, left a comment Duncan.Hull (talk) 13:33, 19 April 2011 (UTC)

Please do not add or change content without verifying it by citing reliable sources, as you did to Mark Bretscher. Before making any potentially controversial edits, it is recommended that you discuss them first on the article's talk page. Please review the guidelines at Wikipedia:Citing sources and take this opportunity to add references to the article. Thank you. Also this was not a minor edit. Please familiarize yourself with what and what does not constitute a minor edit. Thank you. GcSwRhIc (talk) 23:55, 23 April 2011 (UTC)

Edits to Hidden Markov model

I undid your {{cite doi}} and {{cite pmid}} changes because they hide some of the information that the previous, uncompact citations carried. If you feel strongly, please feel free to undo my undo; but if we can somehow have the best of both worlds, that would be best. Thanks! —Quantling (talk | contribs) 22:59, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Lesk was not Chothia's postdoc

Duncan: AML and CC were collaborators at MRC-LMB. To list AML as CC's student or postdoc would be factually incorrect, imo.

110.32.68.216 (talk) 00:28, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

WikiProject Computational Biology

Hi,

Thanks for signing up to Wikipedia:WikiProject_Computational_Biology. There is a growing list of tasks that you can help out with if you have a few free moments. See the discussion page here: Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Computational_Biology. Alexbateman (talk) 09:11, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Use of the cite template

Hi Duncan,

I noticed that on your recent edit of the UniProt article you changed the full inline citation cite template to the one using just the PMID. That seems like a retrograde step to me, given someone has take the time to put in the full citation. Is there some guidance in Wikipedia as to what is preferred? I find it difficult to find out what the best practice is. Cheers Alexbateman (talk) 16:08, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

Hi Alex, I'm never sure what best practice is either. The trouble with full citations is the metadata can be inconsistent (and even wrong), but as you say, they contain more information. On the other hand, the template style citation means that the information can be reused many times (and will at least be consistent too) but the "cite pmid|12345" can be a bit cryptic . I don't mind reverting the edit if you think its better as it was before. Duncan.Hull (talk) 16:26, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

Edits to professor Michael Waterman

Hi Duncan,

I am a student works in the same Department with Prof. Waterman. I am sorry for not letting you know about the changes I did yesterday, but all those changes and modifications are requested and verified by Prof. Waterman and I have undone the changes to the previous version. If you find any problems or typos, please feel free to let me know.

Best Regards.
XILONG FAN

Scientist biographies

Hey, you've been adding additional citations to existing text as a form of "adding links". If your intention is to add citations, you're not actually adding anything; all the text you're sticking them on to is already cited. If you're adding external links, that's not how we do it. Ironholds (talk) 09:47, 23 July 2011 (UTC)

Dear Ironholds, there are two styles of citation here, the original (1) and the one I changed it to (2) which uses a Digital Object Identifier and Template:Cite doi shown below:

1. Smith, J. David (2005). "Colin Eaborn". Biographical Memoirs of Fellows of the Royal Society. 51. The Royal Society. ISSN 0080-4606.
2. Smith, J. D. (2005). "Colin Eaborn. 15 March 1923 - 22 February 2004: Elected F.R.S. 1970". Biographical Memoirs of Fellows of the Royal Society. 51: 101. doi:10.1098/rsbm.2005.0007.

The second style is an improvement on the first and adds important information that is missing by linkg directly through to the original source (the abstract of the article), rather than just the journal itself. IMHO this does actually add something Duncan.Hull (talk) 08:30, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Hi Duncan, I'm spending a bit of time on biographies for scientists in the field of genomics every now and then. I'm going to add them to the lists of Biography/Biologists requests from now on, in case you want to give a look at them: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Wikipedia:Requested_articles/Biography/Biologists Thanks Avilella (talk) Avilella (talk) 17:43, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Hello Avilella, thanks I'll take a look Duncan.Hull (talk) 08:24, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Sure, adding the additional citation is fine; however, if you're going to add it, replace the other citation with it. Otherwise you're just muddying the waters. Ironholds (talk) 09:29, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

OK, will do Duncan.Hull (talk) 09:31, 25 July 2011 (UTC)

Royal Society postnominals to American scientists.

Would you please stop adding FRS or ForRS to the biographies of American scientists such as Barbara McClintock as this is inappropriate. Americans may be entitled to use them but they seldom ever do. McClintock was also entitled to use the postnominals MNAS and FAAAS, but again these are seldom used. Benjamin Franklin used FAPS in hopes I guess of popularizing it, but it is even less popular. It would be better just to add a sentence about their election to the Society in the awards and honors section. Thanks. GcSwRhIc (talk) 14:01, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

OK sorry... seen the error of my ways now

Thanks, just one of those cultural things. Most American scientists are justifiably proud of their election to the Royal Society or other learned societies. The postnominal thing just runs against the long running American aversion to titles (except of course the legal profession where Hon. for judges and esq. for attorneys is the norm, not in Wikipedia though :-). Read about the never ratified Titles of Nobility Amendment if you're interested. Some crack pots have argued that it actually was ratified and that their convictions should be overturned because the legal parties (judges and attorneys) used titles and thus were not U.S. citizens and could not legally hand down judgements. As I said crackpots. GcSwRhIc (talk) 14:27, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

Link in a reference

Is there a reason why you re-instated your link to the John Maynard Smith article in the reference Template:Cite doi/10.1098.2Frsbm.2005.0016? Aside from your personal space usage, the only use for the reference is in the John Maynard Smith article itself, which results in a partially bold title, which deviates from the standard referencing format. Eventually, I plan to write an article about this researcher, and can guarantee that the people at WP:GAN and WP:FAC will request that the link be removed. – VisionHolder « talk » 21:53, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Hello, I have links in references so that they show up when used outside the author page, e.g. the John Maynard Smith biography was authored by Paul H. Harvey and Brian_Charlesworth. See also Leon Mestel who has authored many biographies of scientists.Duncan.Hull (talk) 16:09, 1 September 2011 (UTC)

If these people are already mentioned in these other biographies, wouldn't they already be linked, and thus be a case of overlinking? – VisionHolder « talk » 02:13, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Yes I suppose it could, although it depends on how they are cited Duncan.Hull (talk) 07:28, 2 September 2011 (UTC)

Tom Cherry

I'm puzzled as to why the page is called Thomas MacFarland Cherry when Tom Cherry is a red link (as is Thomas Cherry). Can you think of any reason not to move it to "Tom Cherry"? (Thanks in advance.) Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:09, 21 September 2011 (UTC)

Hi, I think that Thomas MacFarland Cherry is best because it is less ambiguous than Tom Cherry and Thomas Cherry - there is bound to be more than one Thomas Cherry in the world. The Tom Cherry and Thomas Cherry could link appropriately, as with John Smith. Duncan.Hull (talk) 13:11, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

Hmmm. Interesting. (i.e. Not one of the replies I was expecting.) Nevertheless, many thanks for the reply. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 13:49, 22 September 2011 (UTC)

Chamberlain

Do you have a copy of the obit you could email me? Since I worked on the Chamberlain article a bit, it might be helpful to have. Also, I'm starting to eye my sources in preparation for a bit of work on Rise of Neville Chamberlain which I'd like to be TFA next 28 May (the 75th anniversary of his premiership).--Wehwalt (talk) 18:35, 15 October 2011 (UTC)

Yes, sure, here is a copy Duncan.Hull (talk) 15:32, 16 October 2011 (UTC)

Pieter Zeeman

The obituary DOI was incorrect, it had a comma in it, and I couldn't even get the bot to find it with the comma turned into a period. It did find it when I used the old DOI from the previous versions that weren't cite DOI. Please take a look.Naraht (talk) 20:43, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

thanks for correcting it, that looks fine Duncan.Hull (talk) 10:35, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

References

Please do not change existing references to the {{cite doi}} format, as you did here and here. In many cases, they are removing information and ruining the formatting. In the best case, they bring no benefit, so I can see no justification for forcing this decision onto articles. --Stemonitis (talk) 08:07, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Hello, I've been using {{cite doi}} for three reasons

1. the formatting is consistent, everybody formatting by hand their own way is inconsistent
2. the template can then be re-used in other articles, unlike {{cite journal}}
3. it makes editing the article easier because the flow of text isn't interupted by blocks of unwieldy references

IMHO, the only information it could remove is if the various ID's (jstor, pmid etc) aren't included which can easily be corrected. However, that's just me, I know everyone won't necessarily share this point of view Duncan.Hull (talk) 19:20, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Such citations may be consistent with other articles, but without being consistent with other citations in the same article (as in this case), which is far more important. The self-links introduced by the template were another serious problem, because they showed up in boldface. Overall, they added no information, and no improvement, but caused several problems. Had you used the preview before saving the articles you would have noticed. If you have substantive changes to make to an article, then by all means do so, but editing merely to change one form of referencing to a worse one (arguably at least) is not helpful. --Stemonitis (talk) 19:26, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

OK, I shall avoid reverting edits in this way in the future. I still think {{cite doi}} is a superior style for the reasons stated above. The boldface is a feature that allows the reader to quickly scan which references are relevant (and how) see the references in Michael Ashburner for example

All the references in an article should be "relevant"; the boldface merely lets you know which references have been badly formatted for inclusion in that article. I think it looks terrible. (I also dislike the additional "edit" links introduced by {{cite doi}} and its ilk.) It's particularly inappropriate in titles, where links should not generally be introduced. I didn't mention before, but there are also better solutions to your point number 3 – list-defined references, for instance. --Stemonitis (talk) 19:48, 1 February 2012 (UTC)

Affiliation with Sage Bionetworks?

Hello. Do you have any affiliation with Sage? I would love to improve their article but I need help finding a good third-party review of their work. I actually have not contacted their PR department yet, so I am not sure what is available. Do you know them? Blue Rasberry (talk) 18:10, 11 February 2012 (UTC)

Hello, I don't have any affiliation with Sage, just interested in them. The works cited at Sage Bionetworks and Stephen Friend should be a good start though. HTH Duncan.Hull (talk) 10:07, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

WikiProject Open Access

Hi Duncan, have you seen WP:OPENACCESS? Would be nice to have you join in. -- Daniel Mietchen - WiR/OS (talk) 16:42, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Hi Daniel, looks good and needs some work too, I will take a look Duncan.Hull (talk) 20:49, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

Speedy deletion nomination of James Thomas Wilson

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ignore that of course, I removed the tag placed by this beginning new page patroller. In fact, as this is just oner of his many gross errors, I've blocked him from deletion tagging till he has the chance to learn the rules. DGG ( talk ) 17:03, 27 February 2012 (UTC)

Tony Kouzarides

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Speedy deletion nomination of Open PHACTS

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Pedro Mendes

You may disagree with the rationale for the {{db-move}}, but the move should still be reverted since it is not uncontroversial. – PeeJay 09:33, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

Hello PeeJay, OK, can you tell me now to contest the move then? I don't see why football players should receive such high prominence in wikipedia, especially ones who have retired? Mendes is not exactly David Beckham is he? Duncan.Hull (talk) 12:02, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

No, he's not David Beckham, but he's certainly more prominent than any of the other Pedro Mendeses you listed. But that's not for us to decide. We should restore the {{db-move}} tag and then you should follow the instructions at WP:RM. – PeeJay 21:04, 8 August 2012 (UTC)

Nomination of James John Miles for deletion

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Richard Friend's thesis_url

Hi, I notice you reverted my edit on the Richard Friend article. While EThOS is often a useful service for finding copies of theses, Friend's page states "This thesis is not available via the EThOS service. Please contact the current institution's library directly if you wish to view the thesis." Perhaps this link would be better as a reference, rather than a thesis_url? Gareth Jones (talk) 11:08, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

• • yes, sure, as long as there is some URL to trace it

Great, I'll do that. Gareth Jones (talk) 12:50, 26 March 2013 (UTC)

thesis_url

Hello. I fail to see why the addition of a generic link to a limited-access site (www.theses.com) is helpful: [3], [4], [5]. It seems like spamming to me. Could you elaborate on that? --Omnipaedista (talk) 04:18, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Hello Omnipaedista, the reason for adding the link to theses.com on Paul Davies, M. J. Seaton and Edwin Southern was WP:CITE. Normally I would use a URL which linked to the actual content, but in all these cases, AFAIK the title of their PhD theses was not available anywhere else. So IMHO, it's not "spamming" but citing sources as per WP:CITE. If you can find a better source to verify these people's thesis_url and thesis_title, then please go ahead and use it Duncan.Hull (talk) 09:50, 7 May 2013 (UTC)

May 2013

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Nomination of Steve Pettifer for deletion

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• Seymour’, Who Was Who, A & C Black, 1920–2008; online edn, Oxford University Press, Dec 2007 [http://www.ukwhoswho.com/view/article/oupww/whowaswho/U48032, accessed 30 May 2011</ref>

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January 2014

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• War interrupted his research in 1941 and Arkell worked for the [[Ministry of Transport]] in London] when bombing of that city was at its most intense. In this period he became seriously ill,

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A.C.A.B.

Did you read that article? Reference 4 is "Tim Thompson; Sue Black (14 November 2006). Forensic Human Identification: An Introduction. Taylor & Francis. pp. 384–. ISBN 978-0-8493-3954-7. Retrieved 18 October 2012", so it seemed perfectly relevant. The source I added also mentions Black by name as original Secretary and founding member. No tats on my knuckles, honest guv'. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:22, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

The link to UKdvi.org seemed fine when I added it. My edits have been made in good faith and I think your description of them as "vandalism" was misplaced. Would this link be of any use:[6]? Martinevans123 (talk) 15:37, 6 March 2014 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Ashburner 2005

Template:Ashburner 2005 has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Ricky81682 (talk) 08:31, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Benkler 2006

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Discussion at Talk:Cory Doctorow#Cory Doctorow and Creative Commons

You are invited to join the discussion at Talk:Cory Doctorow#Cory Doctorow and Creative Commons. Thanks. Xb2u7Zjzc32 (talk) 01:39, 17 June 2014 (UTC)

Template:cite doi RfC

Because you commented at this discussion, I would appreciate your views at this RfC on the larger issue of DOI templates. Thanks! -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:23, 9 July 2014 (UTC)

August 2014

Edit

Not sure what is with this edit [7]? Doc James (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 22:31, 9 August 2014 (UTC)

Dave Broomhead

Wanna work together on improving Dave's article? U+003F^? 11:32, 21 August 2014 (UTC)

Lovely job, thanks! I don't know what's next really. Perhaps find a template to organise the article. U+003F^? 07:33, 23 August 2014 (UTC)

Anthony Watts

I see that you reverted my change to the hatnote on this article. The reason for the piping of the link through the (disambiguation) redirect is so that those of us at WP:DPL who fix ambiguous links (and the bots that create lists for us) will know that it is an intentional link to a disambiguation page. This is also spelled out at WP:INTDABLINK. -Niceguyedc ^Go Huskies! 19:58, 11 September 2014 (UTC)

• Ah, OK, didn't realise and couldn't see why you had replaced a link that existed with one that doesn't
  • I made a typo in spelling "disambiguation" (I switched two letters), so that's why it was a red link. That was my mistake. -Niceguyedc ^Go Huskies! 01:17, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

Namecheck

at https://blog.wikimedia.org/2014/09/11/new-images-released-are-quickly-put-to-use/ - thanks again! Johnbod (talk) 00:24, 13 September 2014 (UTC)

• Hi John, thanks for the namecheck! Good to see that Martin Hairer picture used so widely. I'm working on the ~15 remaining...

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Eva Beem

Could you please take a look at the article Eva Beem. And see if there are any expansions or improvements that you could do. Appreciate it.--BabbaQ (talk) 15:02, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

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Citation work at Burgi-Dunitz article

You did some earlier work on the referencing at the BD article. I am generally in favour of some simplifications to referencing, via templates, but my understanding is that such changes to existing citation format style are supposed to take place with prior discussion at the article Talk page.

As it stands, many of the changes made at the BD article are problematic, and enough time and edits have accrued, that the citation formatting edits cannot simply be reverted.

I will begin correcting the individual problems -- re-introducing page numbers and number ranges deleted, re-adding the URLs to free versions of online articles, removing redundant references that now appear -- but would ask you do all further broad changes to citation style only with prior discussion in Talk. Profs/editors here barely have time to do work once. We do not have time to do it over and over again. Le Prof Leprof 7272 (talk) 13:46, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

Too many citations

Duncan, I trimmed some of the citations at Clifford Tabin. Please read Wikipedia:Citation overkill for the reasoning. More then three or four cites to a single sentence makes a page difficult to read, and is also never needed. There are still two statements about his research that have six cites each. Please review and pick which ones are the best cites so there are only three or four. Thanks, Oiyarbepsy (talk) 07:49, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

Use of {{Cite doi}}

In this edit, you say you are adding links, but you are also changing ref formats by converting {{cite journal}} to {{cite doi}}. WP:CITEVAR advises in general not to change citation styles (it looks sneaky to do it covered by an unrelated edit-summary). But more importantly, cite-doi itself is by consensus not to be newly used at all (noted on the template's own instructions). DMacks (talk) 12:38, 14 December 2014 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

	The Original Barnstar
	Great work on your new article! SparrowHK (talk) 05:18, 19 December 2014 (UTC)

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July 2015

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Brian Schmidt article reorganization.

With this edit, you reorganized the content of the article. Firstly, I ask that you please put appropriate comments describing what changes you make. In this case, the description said "Added thesis_title, thesis_year and thesis_url to infobox" - nothing about how or why you reorganized the content.

Secondly, and more importantly, I would like to understand why you moved the section on the vineyard and winery to "Personal life". The vineyard and winery are businesses in the fullest sense of the word. His appointment to the board of the federal government's Australian Wine Research Institute reinforces that this is not just some personal hobby. If you have a reason for moving it to "Personal life", please let me know what it is; otherwise it seems to belong under Career. --Gronk Oz (talk) 05:38, 27 July 2015 (UTC)

• Hello Gronk Oz, if you think the winery section would fit better in another section, please go ahead and move it. Running a winery is both a personal hobby and a professional activity, related to his career - so either section would do. As for the short edit descriptions, I apologise for my brevity, but I hope that I improved the article whose structure I personally found jumbled and confusing. Duncan.Hull (talk) 12:17, 28 July 2015 (UTC)

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You're invited! Women in Red World Virtual Edit-a-thon on Women in Science

You are invited! Join us remotely! World Virtual Edit-a-thon on Women in Science

Dates: 8 to 29 November 2015 Location: Worldwide/virtual/online event Host/Facilitator: Women in Red (WiR) in collaboration with Women scientists: Did you know that only 15% of the biographies on Wikipedia are about women? WiR focuses on "content gender gap". If you'd like to help contribute articles on women and women's works, we warmly welcome you! Sponsor: New York Academy of Sciences Event details: This is a virtual edit-a-thon hosted by WiR in parallel with a "phyisical" event during the afternoon of Sunday, November 22 in New York City. It will allow all those keen to improve Wikipedia's coverage of women in science to participate. As the virtual edit-a-thon stretches over three weeks, new participants will be able to draw on the assistance of more experienced editors while creating, translating or improving articles on women who are (or have been) prominent in the field. All levels of Wikipedia editing experience are welcome. RSVP and learn more: →here←--Ipigott (talk) 10:52, 31 October 2015 (UTC)

Sanger institute - full list of faculty

Hello, just been looking at this article and saw the list of faculty. Are we sure hosting this on Wikipedia is a good idea? I feel this will just get dated and still be there in 2025 confusing people unless someone commits to updating it regularly as people come and go. For the same reason, Wikipedia doesn't tend to host long lists of things subject to change like branches of McDonald's. (There's some policy on this but I can't find it.) I just feel the right place to find a reliable faculty list is the Sanger's own webpage and it might make sense to cut the list on Wikipedia back to faculty who have their own Wikipedia pages. (Have also raised this point on the article talk page.) Blythwood (talk) 00:07, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

Yup, sounds fine. Would make sense to reduce it to people who have wiki-pages. Duncan.Hull (talk) 09:24, 13 November 2015 (UTC)

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Sorry!

Sorry about this. One of those embarrassing misclicks when first finding out about another fellow editor! --99of9 (talk) 05:13, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Cite pmid

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Best wishes for the holidays...

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		Wishing you and yours a Happy Holiday Season, and all best wishes for the New Year! Adoration of the Shepherds (Poussin) is my Wiki-Christmas card to all for this year. Johnbod (talk) 10:26, 22 December 2015 (UTC)

Thanks John, and the same to you and yours

December 2015

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Spiral Staircase. Beckford's Tower.jpg

Hi, I found a pic you had uploaded to Flickr & wanted to use it on Beckford's Tower. I uploaded it to commons (as CC 2.0) but another editor has queried this saying your Flickr account is on a blacklist. The discussion is on commons at: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Spiral_Staircase._Beckford%27s_Tower.jpg. Any thoughts?— Rod ^talk 21:28, 22 February 2016 (UTC)

• Hello Rod, my flickr account used to have some copyrighted images in it which I have now removed and this was why the account was blacklisted. How do I go about removing it from the blacklist? Duncan.Hull (talk) 06:28, 31 March 2016 (UTC)
  • Hi Thanks for responding. I don't know how to get this changed, but as part of trying to use the image I got involved in the discussion at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Spiral_Staircase._Beckford%27s_Tower.jpg which includes a link to https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/Files_uploaded_by_Duncan.Hull which is where the decision was made to "blacklist" your flickr images. I would suggest contacting some of the people who are active on commons who have contributed to these discussions and ask what you need to do to lift the blacklisting. Just as an aside I have since visited Beckfords Tower and taken some images of my own which are now in use at Beckford's Tower.— Rod ^talk 16:22, 31 March 2016 (UTC)

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{{Cite_doi}}

Hi, the "cite doi" template was deprecated half a year ago (see discussion here). Instead, please use the {{cite journal|doi= }} template. Thanks. --Randykitty (talk) 12:33, 1 April 2016 (UTC)

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Wikidate infobox

In Pratibha Gai, you used template:Infobox person/Wikidata. Please do not use this. This was a test from two years ago. It is not to be used in articles and will be deleted at some point. The Wikidata parameters and how it will be used in the final version will most likely be different. Please change articles you added this too.

You might be interested in a current RfC... Wikidata in infoboxes, opt-in or opt-out? Bgwhite (talk) 22:49, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

• @Bgwhite: right, I didn't realise that, there is nothing to actually indicate that Template:Infobox person/Wikidata it could do with a BIG RED WARNING like at Template:Cite doi to make it clear it has been deprecated. Seems a shame as there aren't any good alternatives to duplicating data in wikidata and infoboxes (yet) @Mike Peel: Duncan.Hull (talk) 23:05, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
  • Hmm, @Bgwhite: that's a different perspective from mine. Yes, it was a test, but I think it's worth developing and testing much further than it currently is - not deprecating. Over at {{Infobox telescope}} I've been converting the main template to use wikidata directly, but that's not going to work in the much more widely used infobox person template without a lot of wikidrama - so having a separate wikidata-driven version of it for now, which can later be redirected to the main template, seems logical. I spent a bit of time adding more parameters to this last year, and it's on my to-do list to expand it much more... Also ping @RexxS. Thanks. Mike Peel (talk) 06:17, 20 May 2016 (UTC)
    • Mike Peel Most likely, the wikidata info will be incorporated in the main infobox, just like your work in Infobox telescope. This will render the Infobox person/Wikidata template obsolete. Also note, Duncan is not using Infobox person directly, but via module with Infobox scientist (see [8]), thus making it harder for "normal" people to edit. You may have a point if it just was Infobox person, but it is not in this case. I've already been thru this with people jumping the gun on wikidata and I won't be fixing several thousand infoboxes again when the template is deleted or made obsolete. Another example, there's a Philippine's infobox which an editor is making it impossible for most editors to edit it in articles... has if and switch statements for example. Do it right the first time causes much less pain in the end. Bgwhite (talk) 06:48, 20 May 2016 (UTC)
      • Bgwhite Mike Peel RexxS I'm happy to improve and I'm looking for solutions. Currently, authoring wiki-biographies requires information to be entered three times.

1. Once in the body of the article “John Smith (born 1st January 1940)”
2. Once again in wikidata “John Smith date of birth 1940-01-01”
3. And once again in infobox “birth_date = (1940-01-01)January 1, 1940” using either Template:Infobox scientist or Template:Infobox person

This is very tedious, error prone and a waste of editing time. As an interim solution, the infobox person/wikidata seems like a reasonable workaround for the time being (see Keith Shine for example). On the migration issue, it would be fairly easy to write a bot to do whatever conversions are needed in the future. Duncan.Hull (talk) 09:11, 20 May 2016 (UTC)

Medical claims with primary sources

Have trimmed this [9]. We tend not to make medical claims with primary sources. Best Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 02:02, 21 May 2016 (UTC)

• Doc James Thanks, the language needed neutralising a bit. Cut and pasted from a Creative Commons licensed source.

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Biography of Joseph Reagle

Duncan, thanks to your edits of my biography. If you didn't know, I provide a page of biographical factoids that can be used to improve the page---though I abstain from doing this myself for obvious reasons. -Reagle (talk) 14:32, 23 August 2016 (UTC)

• OK, thanks for the info @Reagle: Duncan.Hull (talk) 08:10, 24 August 2016 (UTC)

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Nomination for deletion of Template:GoughPhD

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Edit summaries

I have noticed that most of your edit summaries today have been "(added Template:FRS 1993)", but several of these edits have made more substantial changes. This applies to your recent edit to Colin Patterson (biologist). This article has a history of contentious edits relating to creationism, and I initially suspected that someone was trying to smuggle in something under the cover of a bland edit summary. On closer inspection you have not done this. I have made a partial revert for the reasons given in my edit summary. Please try to make your edit summaries more informative. Thanks, Verbcatcher (talk) 05:13, 8 December 2016 (UTC)

hello @Verbcatcher: I made around 30 edits that were broadly similar because they all added the Template:FRS 1993, so it was easier and quicker to use the drop down menu in the edit summary box, rather than describe every edit individually. Personally, I never trust edit summaries for the reasons you outline above, the most authoritative record of edits is usually the "diff" e.g. this one Duncan.Hull (talk) 09:48, 8 December 2016 (UTC)

New Page: Jeff Forshaw

Hello, thanks for noticing the page, you seem to have a lot of experience with biographies of scientists, are you able to add it to Wikipedia:WikiProject Physics and rate it for scale and importance? I don't think I can do this as I wrote it. Thanks Mramoeba (talk) 12:15, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

Well i'm not sure you can either now, but thanks for the edits! Mramoeba (talk) 14:20, 14 December 2016 (UTC)

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A barnstar for you!

	The Editor's Barnstar
	After listening to her on Radio 4, I had Sadaf Farooqi on my to-do-list, but you beat me to it, and created a much more detailed biography than I would have done. Thank you! Edwardx (talk) 12:39, 26 January 2017 (UTC)

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Jean-Claude Pecker

Hello Duncan, thanks for looking over the Forshaw page from time to time. Maybe you would like to take a look at Jean-Claude Pecker page that I have rewritten, as you seem to have a good eye for this kind of bio! No worries if you don't, I just thought of you. Thanks. Mramoeba (talk) 15:07, 31 March 2017 (UTC)

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Copyright problem on [[Simon Tavaré]

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U.K. system

§ Hi,

Since you are from the U.K., I've couple of questions for you. Back in 2016, Jennifer Doudna of Berkeley was elected foreign member of the Royal Society. Back then, I knew nothing about the Royal Society. How prestigious is that recognition? I've also discovered that Oxford University and Cambridge University in the U.K. have colleges. Are they autonomous? David J. Thouless went to Trinity Hall, Cambridge. Should the page mention that he went to Cambridge University? People outside the U.K. may not know that Trinity Hall is a college of Cambridge University. Ber31 (talk) 06:47, 1 June 2017 (UTC)

Hello @Ber31:, the award is outlined here Fellow of the Royal Society (it is a prestigious award) and the colleges are federal, see Colleges of the University of Cambridge. AFAIK, the colleges don't award degrees, but the University does so I've changed the alma_mater property of David Thouless accordingly.

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Moving pages

Hi Duncan.Hull! I see that you have moved many pages citing disambiguation. Could you explain you reasoning behind this? For example, you moved Jennifer Thomas (physicist) to Jennifer Anne Thomas. A quick google shows nothing relevant for her full name but does for the previous disambiguation. She is not known by her full name and therefore it is inaccurate to have that as the article name as per WP:COMMONNAME. She is, on the other hand, known as the physicist called Jennifer Thomas. Thanks, Gaia Octavia Agrippa ^Talk 12:08, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Hello @Gaia Octavia Agrippa: Thanks for reminding me about WP:COMMONNAMES, I've not read that for a while.

Like Martin Fowler I think that naming things is hard. Personally, I find parentheses in article titles lead to unsatisfactory names - especially for biographies of scientists. What goes in the parentheses is arbitrary and editors often have conflicting opinions, for example should the Ellen Williams article be called:

• Ellen D. Williams (chemist)
• Ellen D. Williams (scientist)
• Ellen D. Williams (physicist) etc

Which is better and why? It isn't always clear. If we knew Ellen's middle name, we could just use that instead. The full name her parents gave her, seems better than any parenthetical word(s) editors can think of (IMHO).

In the case of Jenny Thomas, you are probably right that people are unlikely to search for "Jennifer Anne Thomas". However search engines don't care too much what wikipedia editors call biography pages, so the searches below show Jennifer Anne Thomas prominently in the results

• https://www.google.com/search?q=Jennifer+Thomas
• https://www.google.com/search?q=Jenny+Thomas+Physics
• https://www.google.com/search?q=Jennifer+Thomas+Physics

None of the examples given in WP:COMMONNAMES (Bill Clinton, Bono, Cat Stevens, François Mitterrand, John F. Kennedy, Lady Gaga, Liberace, Mahatma Gandhi and Marie Curie) use parentheses in their article titles. Perhaps this is because parentheses are (according to WP:NATURALDIS) a technique to be used "when none of the other solutions lead to an optimal article title". So the approach of using the full name Jennifer Anne Thomas is precise (as per WP:PRECISION) and an attempt at natural disambiguation "...using an alternative name that the subject is also commonly called in English reliable sources, albeit not as commonly as the preferred-but-ambiguous title..." of Jenny Thomas without using parentheses.

I hope that explains my reasoning (in a nutshell). Naming things is hard and I've tended to opt for precision although Google doesn't care too much what we end up agreeing on. Duncan.Hull (talk) 22:52, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

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A new WiR initiative starting in August

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Royal Society Prizes for Science Books

Hello,

I notice that you recently made edits to the Wikipedia page for the Royal Society Prizes for Science Books and wanted to get in touch. I work on the PR for the Nine Dots Prize, a UK-based social sciences prize that seeks to reward original thinking in response to contemporary societal issues. The Prize launched last year and announced its first winner, James Williams, on 31st May 2017. You can read more about the Prize and James on the Prize's website: http://ninedotsprize.org

The Prize is incredibly generous (the winner receives a book deal with Cambridge University Press and US$100,000) but it does not yet have its own wikipedia page. I was wondering if you might be interested in creating one?

Do let me know if this is something you might like to do and if there is any way I can help.

Best wishes, Bookworm0956 (talk) 15:03, 21 August 2017 (UTC)

This is an archive of past discussions with User:Duncan.Hull. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

Archive 1

Archive 2