Wikipedia talk:WikiProject London/Archive 8

Archive 5Archive 6Archive 7Archive 8Archive 9Archive 10→Archive 13

Invitation to User Study

Would you be interested in participating in a user study? We are a team at University of Washington studying methods for finding collaborators within a Wikipedia community. We are looking for volunteers to evaluate a new visualization tool. All you need to do is to prepare for your laptop/desktop, web camera, and speaker for video communication with Google Hangout. We will provide you with a Amazon gift card in appreciation of your time and participation. For more information about this study, please visit our wiki page (http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research:Finding_a_Collaborator). If you would like to participate in our user study, please send me a message at Wkmaster (talk) 18:12, 15 March 2014 (UTC).

Operation Othona

Anyone got any thoughts on the stub article Operation Othona? There are various things about it coming out in the press so it could probably be expanded. Yaris678 (talk) 11:20, 7 April 2014 (UTC)

Help with a new editor?

I moved an article to the userspace for User:Sky1claw0, who wants to create an article on Elizabethan London. We already have a section on it at Tudor London and I've told him that he would still need to to the usual (sources, etc) to show that we need a separate article as a whole. I figure that there is merit in potentially working on an article for this and I've asked him to check in with this WP and with WP:ENGLAND as well. He's pretty new, so I think that it would be a very good idea for someone to assist him with this process, hence this message here. Tokyogirl79 (｡◕‿◕｡) 06:00, 20 April 2014 (UTC)

Requested move discussion for Grade I and II* listed buildings

See Talk:Grade I and II* listed buildings in the London Borough of Barking and Dagenham#Requested move. Ham (talk) 18:40, 22 April 2014 (UTC)

Something is definitely missing here. What about Grade II listed buildings? Simply south ...... time, department skies for just 8 years 20:51, 2 May 2014 (UTC)
The lists were created for the Wiki Loves Monuments 2013 competition, and it was decided not to include Grade II-listed buildings for that year's competition (which was the first the UK had taken part in) as there would be too many of them. Whether the same decision will be made for WLM 2014 in September I don't know. Ham (talk) 17:25, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

Requested move discussion for parks and open spaces in London

See Talk:Barking and Dagenham parks and open spaces#Requested moves. Ham (talk) 17:25, 3 May 2014 (UTC)

AfC submission - 22/05

Wikipedia talk:Articles for creation/St John's Downshire Hill. FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 01:48, 22 May 2014 (UTC)

Shooter's Hill, or Shooters Hill

I am trying to fix an issue, I am bringing it up here as the article in question doesn't have huge amount of traffic and I don't want the thread to go dead. The article Shooter's Hill, currently has an apostrophe, every now and then someone adds or removes apostrophes to mentions of the place name but the title and infoboxes else where remain unchanged. As far as I can tell both spellings are used in published material, maps, and by the council, I haven't seen anywhere here or anywhere discussing this issue. I believe both spellings should be mentioned in the lead, then all other spellings after should match including title, and idealy other article mentions and infoboxes too, I don't even have a preference to one spelling I just think an article should be consistant. I would just like other users opinions as to which spelling to pick before I try to fix it. Also am I right to try and fix this. I am sure it's sensible wiki rules to use on spelling within an article and have the title match obviously as in any other encyclopedia or text. Has any other place, in London or anywhere experienced a similar issue?  Carlwev  18:36, 31 May 2014 (UTC)

see thread here

Talk:Shooter's_Hill#Apostophe_or_not.3F..._Article_title_and_spelling

Metropolitan police images

I've been in correspondence with the Metropolitan Police (the police service for London, England) over the last few months, discussing the possibility of them open-licensing some of their images - not least the scenic (as opposed to scene-of-crime) pictures taken from their helicopters, and/ or images posted to their social media accounts.

They have decided that they so not wish to do so on a blanket basis, but say that they are willing to consider requests to do so for images in an individual basis. You may send requests to: DMC-Mailbox-.PressBureau-DMC@met.pnn.police.uk Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 16:39, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Thanks for this, Andy! Johnbod (talk) 21:05, 2 June 2014 (UTC)

Wiki Loves Pride 2014

You are invited to participate in Wiki Loves Pride 2014, a campaign to create and improve LGBT-related content at Wikipedia and its sister projects. The campaign will take place throughout the month of June, culminating with a multinational edit-a-thon on June 21. Meetups are being held in some cities, or you can participate remotely. All constructive edits are welcome in order to contribute to Wikipedia's mission of providing quality, accurate information. Articles within Category:LGBT in Europe may be of particular interest. You can also upload LGBT-related images by participating in Wikimedia Commons' LGBT-related photo challenge. You are encouraged to share the results of your work here. Happy editing! --Another Believer (Talk) 18:47, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

Leaflet For Wikiproject London At Wikimania 2014

Hi all,

My name is Adi Khajuria and I am helping out with Wikimania 2014 in London.

One of our initiatives is to create leaflets to increase the discoverability of various wikimedia projects, and showcase the breadth of activity within wikimedia. Any kind of project can have a physical paper leaflet designed - for free - as a tool to help recruit new contributors. These leaflets will be printed at Wikimania 2014, and the designs can be re-used in the future at other events and locations.

This is particularly aimed at highlighting less discoverable but successful projects, e.g:

• Active Wikiprojects: Wikiproject Medicine, WikiProject Video Games, Wikiproject Film

• Tech projects/Tools, which may be looking for either users or developers.

• Less known major projects: Wikinews, Wikidata, Wikivoyage, etc.

• Wiki Loves Parliaments, Wiki Loves Monuments, Wiki Loves ____

• Wikimedia thematic organisations, Wikiwomen’s Collaborative, The Signpost

For more information or to sign up for one for your project, go to:
Project leaflets
Adikhajuria (talk) 09:14, 13 June 2014 (UTC)

Rhyming slang on the main page

Rhyming slang on the main page

Good afternoon, as you will surely know we are working to bring Rhyming Slang to the main page of Wikipedia, please make your comments in the relevant sections Above.

Yours,

Horatio Snickers (talk) 00:16, 19 June 2014 (UTC)

Renaming of Proposed rail infrastructure in the United Kingdom & London subcategories

Please see my proposal to rename Category:Proposed rail transport in England, Category:Proposed rail transport in Scotland, Category:Proposed rail transport in Wales, Category:Proposed rail transport in Northern Ireland, Category:Rail Infrastructure projects in the United Kingdom Category:Transport projects in London & Category:Proposed transport projects in London; all subcategories of Category:Proposed rail infrastructure in the United Kingdom Hugo999 (talk) 13:54, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

Hi, I'd welcome comments on the List of public art in the City of Westminster at its FLC discussion page. Thanks, Ham (talk) 19:40, 29 July 2014 (UTC)

Photograph requests

Is there a place where Wikiproject users may be reminded that there are photograph requests? At Commons:Commons:Picture_requests/Requests/Europe#London several are listed. Several, mainly airline offices and corporate offices, are requests I had made, but there are some requests from other users too WhisperToMe (talk) 15:34, 23 August 2014 (UTC)

Walthamstow by-election, 1910

On Saturday I started writing what I thought would turn into a start-class article on the Walthamstow by-election, 1910 ... but it kinda grew, and has ended up at over 2600 words.

Would any other editors like to review it, and see if they can improve it? Apart from a lack of illustrations, the major failing I can see is that it relies very heavily on the archives of The Times newspaper, which was in general was openly biased towards the Conservatives (although its coverage of this election was largely neutral in tone). If anyone has access to the archives of the Manchester Guardian or Labour-supporting papers, that would help to provide fuller coverage on other perspectives. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 10:33, 3 September 2012‎ (UTC)

London Public Art Task Force

There is a new task force for creating and improving articles on London's public art; please join here! Ham (talk) 09:14, 20 September 2014 (UTC)

Comment on the WikiProject X proposal

Hello there! As you may already know, most WikiProjects here on Wikipedia struggle to stay active after they've been founded. I believe there is a lot of potential for WikiProjects to facilitate collaboration across subject areas, so I have submitted a grant proposal with the Wikimedia Foundation for the "WikiProject X" project. WikiProject X will study what makes WikiProjects succeed in retaining editors and then design a prototype WikiProject system that will recruit contributors to WikiProjects and help them run effectively. Please review the proposal here and leave feedback. If you have any questions, you can ask on the proposal page or leave a message on my talk page. Thank you for your time! (Also, sorry about the posting mistake earlier. If someone already moved my message to the talk page, feel free to remove this posting.) Harej (talk) 22:47, 1 October 2014 (UTC)

WP:VG comments subpages cleanup

Hi, there is currently a discussion taking place at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Video games#VG comments subpages regarding whether it would be acceptable to permanently shift all comments subpages associated with WP:VG articles into talk. This shift would follow the recommended approach given at WP:DCS. The WikiProject London articles that would be affected by this action are these:

If you have objections related specifically to WikiProject London's use of these subpages, please make this clear at the discussion so that other unrelated talk pages can be cleaned up where appropriate. Thank you. -Thibbs (talk) 15:56, 16 October 2014 (UTC)

Old maps and views of London

As you might have seen in the Signpost this week, there's currently a drive to go through the million 19th century images released by the British Library last year, and identify all the maps, with a view to their being georeferenced by BL volunteers, and then uploaded to Commons early next year. As of Sunday night, over five thousand new maps have been identified, with 26.5% of the target books looked at -- but see here for latest figures, and information.

A part that may specifically interest this project is

c:Commons:British Library/Mechanical Curator collection/Synoptic index/London

which currently shows pink templated links for 288 Flickr book pages still to be looked at. (Together with lots of other parts of England, and indeed of the world, still to be looked through as well).

Any help looking through these would be very much appreciated -- as well as the maps (and ground plans) for tagging, you may well also find other interesting or useful non-map views that may be worth considering or uploading for London articles.

Thanks, Jheald (talk) 00:56, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

7digital Article: Start-Class Low/Low-importance WikiProject Help

This 7digital article is within the scope of WikiProject London and I was hoping someone could either help or tell me how to help improve this article regarding London. Thanks :) Llamalady28 (talk) 11:26, 19 November 2014 (UTC)

Wanted: Articles for sculptures, monuments and memorials in London

Following is a list of sculptures, monuments and memorials without Wikipedia articles. User:Ham and I have put this list together and we believe the links below reflect the most appropriate article titles based on naming conventions. I have been creating many articles for London artworks since my recent visit to the city, but I welcome other editors to please assist with the creation of these articles to help improve the encyclopedia.

All help welcome! ----Another Believer (Talk) 23:47, 18 September 2014 (UTC)

Update: I've amended the list by removing entries that now have articles and added more works missing Wikipedia entries. Happy editing! ---Another Believer (Talk) 16:24, 26 November 2014 (UTC)

Greater London articles

English wikipedia has articles for Greater London Council, Greater London Authority and Greater London. The Greater London article seems to have been named London Region in the past and been renamed but it is really not clear what it is meant to be the subject of this. It has most of the language links. It seems to me that we need an article on London Region (an official entity including both the GLA and the City of London but the main article should be the Greater London Authority article since that is the entity which has the twin cities and the budget etc. We may also need a general London article to pull the others together. Yes? No? filceolaire (talk) 20:50, 28 November 2014 (UTC)

WikiProject X is live!

Hello everyone!

You may have received a message from me earlier asking you to comment on my WikiProject X proposal. The good news is that WikiProject X is now live! In our first phase, we are focusing on research. At this time, we are looking for people to share their experiences with WikiProjects: good, bad, or neutral. We are also looking for WikiProjects that may be interested in trying out new tools and layouts that will make participating easier and projects easier to maintain. If you or your WikiProject are interested, check us out! Note that this is an opt-in program; no WikiProject will be required to change anything against its wishes. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thank you!

Note: To receive additional notifications about WikiProject X on this talk page, please add this page to Wikipedia:WikiProject X/Newsletter. Otherwise, this will be the last notification sent about WikiProject X.

Harej (talk) 16:57, 14 January 2015 (UTC)

List of people from London - why this format?

Hi London wikieditors, just wondering why it is listed by boroughs; most lists of notable people are usually divided by surname, they are easy to browse:) Coolabahapple (talk) 09:18, 19 February 2015 (UTC)

Only Fools and Horses - FAR

I've put Only Fools and Horses up for review of its featured status at Wikipedia:Featured article review/Only Fools and Horses/archive1. Improvements and comments welcome. BencherliteTalk 11:20, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

Proposal to move Methodism to Child Project

Per Wikipedia:WikiProject Council/Proposals/Methodism Jerodlycett (talk) 09:45, 4 March 2015 (UTC)

AfC submission

See here. Thanks, FoCuSandLeArN (talk) 13:08, 20 March 2015 (UTC)

Preparing for TFD merge

Hello, I've started a discussion about the start of a TFD merge of two London railway station templates. The discussion is here, I'm just dropping a note here in case anyone is interested. - X201 (talk) 15:48, 31 March 2015 (UTC)

Why do our maps start the Thames in Richmond?

A lot of our maps of London boroughs, such as File:City of Westminster in Greater London.svg, only show the River Thames starting from a point in Richmond. This suggests that the Thames' headwaters are in Richmond! Can't we demand more accuracy than that? NeonMerlin 07:11, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

@NeonMerlin: It's not the headwaters, they are out in Gloucestershire, about a mile north of Kemble. Quite simply, the highest point to which tides normally flow is Teddington Lock, which is in the London Borough of Richmond upon Thames. --Redrose64 (talk) 07:40, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

Move proposal: Disambiguate Burning of Parliament (British) and Burning of the Parliament Buildings in Montreal

There is a proposal to move Burning of Parliament to Burning of British Parliament and Burning of the Parliament Buildings in Montreal to Burning of Canadian Parliament. Please take part in the discussion at Talk:Burning of Parliament#Requested move 8 May 2015. Curly Turkey ¡gobble! 15:16, 8 May 2015 (UTC)

Sade Adu listed at Requested moves

A requested move discussion has been initiated for Sade Adu to be moved to Sade. This page is of interest to this WikiProject and interested members may want to participate in the discussion here. —RMCD bot 22:30, 28 May 2015 (UTC)

Defining a town: Croydon

I have opened a discussion on Talk:Croydon about how to define the town for purposes of population statistics. Any input from editors with experience of similar problems elsewhere would be welcome. GrindtXX (talk) 13:07, 1 July 2015 (UTC)

Administrative area and region

I've proposed removing the distinction between the Greater London administrative area and the London region at Talk:Greater London here. This change would affect a large number of London-related articles (primarily changing all references to the "Greater London administrative area" to "Greater London region") such as London, Greater London Authority, the districts of Greater London, etc; so input would be appreciated. Rob984 (talk) 13:18, 9 July 2015 (UTC)

Rob ... I'm coming at London from the other end, and hitting the problems of using a simple 'London' tag where a borough tag would be a lot more use. The main problem here is that Facebook is using the data from wikipedia for their 'places' directory, but are using the wikipedia page name as gospel, where the borough would be a lot more practical. I have a large list of ,London references which I'd like to rename to their Borough name and start to group all of the relevant Borough material together rather than lumping them all under 'London' Lsces (talk) 22:07, 19 July 2015 (UTC)

King's Cross Central

Hi there, I would like to improve the King's Cross Central page a bit. About 50% is repetition of the King's Cross area's history, which I think is irrelevant for this page, which should concentrate on the development itself. It also lacks information about the controversies that led to the current proposals. I thought I would ask before culling the history section however. I have left a question at Talk:King's Cross Central Jim Killock (talk) 10:20, 23 August 2015 (UTC)

Outer London Boroughs / pre GLA counties

Hello, this may overlap with one or more of the points raised above. What is the convention for outer areas like say, Chislehurst which falls under London Borough of Bromley but the postal address is Kent? Do we say 'Chislehurst, Kent', or 'Chislehurst, London' when mentioning (linking) the page in articles generally? (Where the page name doesn't already carry a geo qualifier). I know pages refer to the ceremonial county as Greater London and the region as London. Thanks. Regards, Eagleash (talk) 10:14, 30 August 2015 (UTC)

Postal counties were for the convenience of the post office, to aid in sorting, and do not necessarily bear any direct relation to the true location. Essentially, they are the county in which the sorting office lay prior to 1965. They no longer form part of a valid postal address, so long as the post town and postcode are both present. You can test this by visiting Postcode Finder – Find an Address, enter your own postcode and see what it comes back with. When I try this for BR7 5NN it comes back with:
London & South Eastern Railway
Railway Station
Station Approach
CHISLEHURST
BR7 5NN
--Redrose64 (talk) 20:18, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
Yes I know all that but how do we express the area when linking to articles. E.g. someone born in Chislehurst (again, say) do we say Chislehurst, Kent, or Chislehurst, London? Some areas already have a qualifier e.g. Farnborough, London but if you ask a resident they'll say they live in Farnborough, Kent and so would someone from Chislehurst. Eagleash (talk) 20:36, 30 August 2015 (UTC)
If they are born in Chislehurst from 1965 onwards, London. Kent before then. An appropriate page title would be Chislehurst, London. AusLondonder (talk) 20:29, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

Template:Infobox London Assembly constituency

I was wondering if someone could add a field for electorate to Template:Infobox London Assembly constituency, in a similar style to UK Parliament constituencies if no objections exist? AusLondonder (talk) 20:33, 16 September 2015 (UTC)

Request for Homo naledi photos at the NHM

Fossil casts of the the recently described Homo naledi are on display at the London Natural History Museum.[1] If anyone is willing and able to take some high quality photographs of the fossils and release them to Commons with a CC license, that would be a great contribution. Cheers, --Animalparty! (talk) 17:42, 27 September 2015 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ Homo naledi fossil prints come to London. BBC News

Invite to Wikimeets

Anyone who fancies chatting to Wikipedians/Wikimedians in London is invited to join us at one or both of the following wikimeets:

  • London 98 at the Pendrel's Oak in central London, from 1pm onwards on Sunday 11 October.
    These meets happen at the same time and same place on the second Sunday of every month.
  • East London 2 at Waitrose Cafe in Canary Wharf, from 7:30pm to 9:00pm on Tuesday 27 October.
    There is no regular schedule for these meets yet, so if you would prefer a different time or venue next month then comment on event page on meta.

Full details are on the pages on meta (follow the links!) and please feel free to share the invite with anyone you know who might be interested, whatever their level of experience on Wikipedia or other Wikimedia sites. Thryduulf (talk) 23:28, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

I've geonoticed both of them. --Redrose64 (talk) 09:02, 7 October 2015 (UTC)

St Paul's Cathedral - citations

There have been two glaring errors in the citations system for over two years now. It would be good if someone with a more intimate knowledge of the article and its sources could address these issues --Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 01:18, 21 October 2015 (UTC)

Opinions sought at Talk:Bromley London Borough Council please.

I've started a discussion at Talk:Bromley London Borough Council, regarding disagreements over the article's Criticism section. Opinions are invited, please. 823510731 (talk) 17:59, 15 November 2015 (UTC)

William Sterndale Bennett

I am hoping to get this article up to GA/FA standard for WSB's bicentenary (April 2016) and have therefore initiated a peer review - comments would be very welcome.--Smerus (talk) 10:01, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Battersea Power Station

I have proposed to split this. Please see Talk:Battersea Power Station#The area. Simply south ...... time, deparment skies for just 9 years 20:07, 18 December 2015 (UTC)

New image, possible template for Transport for London

Hi, this may be of interest to the project. Thanks for feedback, M∧Ŝc2ħεИτlk 16:07, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Climate of London

Hi The article Climate of London has been created, it would be great if any project members could assist in improving the article. Thanks! AusLondonder (talk) 06:14, 4 February 2016 (UTC)

Shadwell

Can someone please rerate Shadwell- I'm expanded it greatly, so it's no longer start class. I'm thinking it's probably B class, but do people think it's anywhere near being able to be a GA? Joseph2302 (talk) 20:36, 12 February 2016 (UTC)

Articles for geocoding

Hi. I just thought I'd let you all know that there's currently an opportunity for those interested in geocoding articles to add geographic coordinate information to over 400 articles listed under Category:London articles missing geocoordinate data. For more information on how to do this, please see WP:COORD and Template:Coord. -- The Anome (talk) 12:36, 10 March 2016 (UTC)

Trouble finding references? The Wikipedia Library is proud to announce ...

The Wikipedia Library

Alexander Street Press (ASP) is an electronic academic database publisher. Its "Academic Video Online: Premium collection" includes videos in a range of subject areas, including news programs (like 60 minutes) and newsreels, music and theatre, speeches and lectures and demonstrations, and documentaries. This collection would be useful for researching topics related to science, engineering, history, music and dance, anthropology, business, counseling and therapy, news, nursing, drama, and more. For more topics see their website.

There are up to 30 one-year ASP accounts available to experienced Wikipedians through this partnership. To apply for free access, please go to WP:ASP. Cheers! {{u|Checkingfax}} {Talk} 21:28, 25 March 2016 (UTC)

Palmyra arch in Trafalgar Square

Could someone take a picture of the Monumental Arch of Palmyra replica that was installed in Trafalgar Square yesterday please? Xwejnusgozo (talk) 14:55, 20 April 2016 (UTC)

Shakespeare in London event

Hi everyone, on Saturday 7th May the Senate House Library is hosting an editathon about Shakespeare in London. You're welcome to come along and details of the event are on the registration page. Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 11:04, 4 May 2016 (UTC)

Richard Nevell (WMUK) Am I right in thinking there's an entrance fee to the building, or are people attending this Wikimedia event exempt from that fee? Joseph2302 (talk) 17:17, 4 May 2016 (UTC)
@Joseph2302: People going to the event get in free (I think the library usually charges a membership fee). Richard Nevell (WMUK) (talk) 10:04, 5 May 2016 (UTC)

Please comment on a RfC at Talk:Jeremy Corbyn#RfC on infobox image

Please share your input in an RfC relating to what image should be used in the infobox at the Wikipedia page for the Leader of the British Labour Party AusLondonder (talk) 09:35, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

Kensington Church

John Ash (physician) refers to Kensington Church. which church would that be, please? Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:08, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

Old St Mary Abbots ‑ Iridescent 19:20, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
Adding (and pinging), I don't know if his grave still exists, if that's what you're looking for. The present-day St Mary Abbots does preserve some monuments from the old church, but standard CofE practice in London in this period was to exhume and reuse graves on a first-in-first-out basis rather than expand the area allocated for burials, so very few graves from before the mid 19th century survive, other than those in family chapels or the tombs of people wealthy or powerful enough to ensure preservation in perpetuity. ‑ Iridescent 19:42, 19 May 2016 (UTC)
@Iridescent: Thank you. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 20:12, 19 May 2016 (UTC)

Auto-assessment of article classes

Following a recent discussion at WP:VPR, there is consensus for an opt-in bot task that automatically assesses the class of articles based on classes listed for other project templates on the same page. In other words, if WikiProject A has evaluated an article to be C-class and WikiProject B hasn't evaluated the article at all, such a bot task would automatically evaluate the article as C-class for WikiProject B.

If you think auto-assessment might benefit this project, consider discussing it with other members here. For more information or to request an auto-assessment run, please visit User:BU RoBOT/autoassess. This is a one-time message to alert projects with over 1,000 unassessed articles to this possibility. ~ RobTalk 01:12, 4 June 2016 (UTC)

Draft:Outline of London

I don't know if anyone is interested in outlines but there's an old draft for an outline of all the London articles at Draft:Outline of London that could be worked on and mainspaced. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 23:28, 9 June 2016 (UTC)

Delete it with fire; I don't see how it could ever satisfy NPOV since the selections are always going to be arbitrary, and I fail to see how it could ever serve any useful purpose to any reader. It seems to be a hugely subjective and virtually random list of what one editor happened to consider important, and some of the selections are truly bizarre. (An utterly generic office block, a cluster of grim 1960s flats, a singularly uninteresting Wandsworth park, a government department which was disbanded over 50 years ago, a defunct and long-since demolished music venue with no particular architectural or musical significance…) Taking 2000 years of history of a polycentric conurbation with undefined borders and a population higher than many countries, and trying to distil it into a list of bullet points, is always going to be a fool's errand; there are entire boroughs which this list in its present form fails to mention. ‑ Iridescent 23:47, 9 June 2016 (UTC)
I don't agree with that at all. Outline of articles are fairly common, see Category:Outlines of U.S. states and the full list. The Barbican is Grade II listed by the way. Sure it needs improvement but it would be a useful article. AusLondonder (talk) 00:50, 10 June 2016 (UTC)
There exist many outlines out there. The closet city one is Outline of Metro Manila. As I said, if anyone is interested. Else, it'll sit in draftspace along with other London-topical drafts. -- Ricky81682 (talk) 05:44, 10 June 2016 (UTC)

Featured article review of Covent Garden

I have nominated Covent Garden for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here.  — Scott • talk 22:55, 14 June 2016 (UTC)

Algerian Coffee Stores

Reading that Admiral Duncan (pub) article, I was reminded that it is next door to the Algerian Coffee Stores, also a Soho fixture. The Coffee Stores has been trading since 1887, making the business now 129 years old, and I can see that it is listed in a large number of London guidebooks, as well as being mentioned in a number of non-guidebook publications. Does this have sufficient notability for an article?

We should also consider having an article on Maison Bertaux, which has been trading since 1871, making it 145 years old. . -- The Anome (talk) 12:14, 15 June 2016 (UTC)

Created Maison Bertaux, help expanding it would be appreciated (would like a DYK on it). Joseph2302 (talk) 21:27, 15 June 2016 (UTC)
Thank you! What a great article! -- The Anome (talk) 11:01, 17 June 2016 (UTC)


This Sunday

Whilst I appreciate that not everyone interested in London actually manages to be in London, for those of you who are we have our monthly meetup in the Oak this Sunday. For those of you who aren't in London it is a good page to make requests for photographs of things that Londoners can photograph. ϢereSpielChequers 11:52, 6 July 2016 (UTC)

info box church elements.

I don't know who wrote the code to the info boxes, but St Dunstan-in-the-East and many other articles, the address field doesn't work correctly. I tried to enter the full address in the info box as no full address with post code is down for the article. I had an error msg on preview when I tried to enter the data. Maybe someone can have a look at the infobox church and fix it so for all those articles, so that a proper address should be present. If you are going to have any article about a building in London, you should at least tell people where it is!! Govvy (talk) 23:23, 11 July 2016 (UTC)

Govvy According to the template the parameter should be 'location' rather than 'address' and the instruction is that it should contain the city or province. You could try inserting the full address now the param has been changed. Eagleash (talk) 00:06, 12 July 2016 (UTC)
Well I changed it, how do you think it looks now? Also, should there be a gallery section under the history to put images in so people can understand it more from that? Govvy (talk) 12:46, 18 July 2016 (UTC)
@Govvy: Galleries are discouraged, see WP:IG; instead, ensure that all relevant images are in c:Category:St Dunstan-in-the-East. --Redrose64 (talk) 20:10, 18 July 2016 (UTC)
Galleries are NOT discouraged, see WP:IG! What is on Commons is a completely different matter, and if there are enough good photos a gallery is a very good idea. Johnbod (talk) 02:08, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
Although WP:NOTGALLERY ia always a consideration, tidying the few images into a gallery is not an unreasonable suggestion in this case IMO. Eagleash (talk) 03:35, 19 July 2016 (UTC)
WP:IG begins by saying "Images are typically interspersed individually throughout an article near the relevant text", so this is the preferred method. The second paragraph begins with "However, Wikipedia is not an image repository. A gallery is not a tool to shoehorn images into an article".
The thing about Commons is that the article already has a {{commons category}} which gives a direct link to c:Category:St Dunstan-in-the-East. --Redrose64 (talk) 16:49, 19 July 2016 (UTC)

Photo request at W1D 7BB (Soho)

Hello, I am writing an article about a London restaurant, it is currently at Draft:Bocca di Lupo. There are two relevant photographs already on Wikimedia Commons taken by other people, however neither is really suitable for the infobox of the article. If anyone is nearby central London or can get there easily, would you be able to take a photo of the front of the restaurant and upload it to Commons and let me know please? Its address is 12 Archer Street, London, W1D 7BB. Apparently this is in the Soho district. MPS1992 (talk) 18:16, 4 August 2016 (UTC)

Have you looked on Geograph? Archer Street is approximately at TQ295808 so Geograph may have suitable images in that and surrounding centisquares:
TQ294809 TQ295809 TQ296809
TQ294808 TQ295808 TQ296808
TQ294807 TQ295807 TQ296807
if you can find one, I can upload it to Commons at maximum resolution. --Redrose64 (talk) 22:54, 4 August 2016 (UTC)
Thank you, what a fascinating facility. I was able to find some general views of Archer Street on Geograph, but not any of the restaurant. Searching Google images brings up a number of suitable images, but restricting the license to "free to share, use or modify, even for commercial use" causes all the relevant ones to disappear from the search results. So I would really like someone to take a free image of the restaurant if they happen to be passing the area, please. MPS1992 (talk) 18:49, 5 August 2016 (UTC)

Image update

File:London Underground Zone 1 with street map.jpg needs updating- Shoreditch High Street is in zone 1, and Hoxton is in Zone 1/2, see [1]. I asked a year ago on the Commons file about it, but no-one replied, so I was hoping someone here might know how to update it. Joseph2302 06:47, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

@Joseph2302: Have you asked at Wikipedia:Graphics Lab/Map workshop? --Redrose64 (talk) 16:27, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

Photograph of Regent Street Cinema

Hi, would anyone be able to take a few photographs of Regent Street Cinema? Specifically, the building itself and, if possible, the inside theatre. Anarchyte (work | talk) 06:47, 11 September 2016 (UTC)

@Anarchyte: Have you looked on Geograph? I believe that the theatre is approximately at TQ288814 so Geograph may have suitable images in that and surrounding centisquares:
TQ287815 TQ288815 TQ289815
TQ287814 TQ288814 TQ289814
TQ287813 TQ288813 TQ289813
if you can find one, I can upload it to Commons at maximum resolution. --Redrose64 (talk) 16:17, 11 September 2016 (UTC)
@Redrose64: I had a look at location you mentioned the surrounding areas and couldn't find anything. Anarchyte (work | talk) 06:28, 12 September 2016 (UTC)

Highgate Cemetery

FYI I've took some pictures in the East part of the cemetery. I've covered about 70% of the official map. Everything is on Commons (see Category:Graves at Highgate Cemetery). I just need more time to create a category per grave. I was surprised to see a very small amount of photos of this famous cemetery on Commons. And there is still almost nothing on the West part of the cemetery ;) Pyb (talk) 10:35, 15 September 2016 (UTC)

Photo request: new 4th plinth sculpture

The new sculpture on the fourth plinth is now in place, but our article doesn't yet have a photo of it. If someone happens by, a photo would be most welcome. According to commons:Commons:Freedom of panorama#United Kingdom, it should be okay to upload it to Commons. -- Finlay McWalter··–·Talk 12:48, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

Freedom of Panorama won't apply—it only applies if permanently situated in a public place or in premises open to the public (my emphasis). See commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Temporary statue of Air-Vice Marshal K R Park on the fourth plinth.jpg, commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Ship in a bottle 2 (4866065259).jpg, commons:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Sculpture entitled "Alison Lapper Pregnant" - geograph.org.uk - 104026.jpg etc etc etc—we delete these things on sight if anyone uploads them unless they're uploaded under fair use for discussion of the sculpture(s) in question. ‑ Iridescent 16:13, 29 September 2016 (UTC)

Photo request - Croydon

Are there any editors in the Croydon area that can take photographs of the various floral tributes laid in respect of the 2016 Croydon tram derailment? Mjroots (talk) 15:47, 16 November 2016 (UTC)

Greetings WikiProject London/Archive 8 Members!

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Corner of St Paul's Churchyard

One publisher advertisement from 1884 gives address "Corner, St. Paul's–Churchyard, London" (Griffith, Farran, Okeden, and Welsh; perhaps a year 1884 successor to Griffith and Farran--). Initially I interpreted that "corner of St Paul's and Churchyard" but no, not after visiting our St Paul's Cathedral; Old St Paul's; St Paul's Cross.

What does "northeast corner of the [St Paul's] churchyard" mean? In particular, at Old St Paul's Cathedral#Decline (16th century), does the painting show all of St Paul's Churchyard, with pulpit in northeast corner, foreground, and southwest corner against the building, in the middle of the painting? Or is the entire ground-space depicted called the NE corner, with SW corner beyond the building at the opposite end of the plot of land; and NE SW SE corners all invisible behind the building?

--P64 (talk) 23:37, 14 November 2016 (UTC)

Churchyard is being used here in the traditional British sense of the land surrounding a church, rather than a specific "yard" associated with the church as shown in that picture. In this case there's a second meaning, in that St Paul's Churchyard is the name of a road, or rather two roads, that now cover part of the old churchyard. If you look at eg Google Maps, you'll see the name applied to just the road on the south side of the cathedral, between Ludgate Hill and Cannon St. But informally the road on the NW side of the cathedral also takes the same name even if Google calls it Paternoster Row. My 1998 A-Z shows that road as St Paul's Churchyard as well, with Paternoster Row just the eastern end of what Google now shows as Paternoster Row; I assume that the renaming happened during the Paternoster Square redevelopment of the late 90s. So the NE corner of "St Paul's Churchyard" will have been in what is now garden ("North Churchyard") up towards the northern end of New Change; which would make sense in this context given that old Paternoster Row was the traditional home of London's publishers. Le Deluge (talk) 10:52, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
  • In 18th to 19th century records 'yard' usually has a specific meaning. It can define a district/area but just as often describes a small walled yard of houses & businesses going by a particular name. It doesn't have to mean a 'churchyard' but rather one of those many places of commerce & residence from the 15th/early 16th century (booksellers & publishers in Shakespeare's time, for example) that was on the outskirts of St. Paul's (or whatever - there was more than one St. Pauls in London) & survived. For Wikipedia purposes (NO original research!) find it marked on a linkable or, preferably, public domain map you can upload & include. Maps & descriptions can often be found on old books on http://www.archive.org AnonNep (talk) 15:50, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
For instance of "reliable" usage that implies "northeast corner" in a geographic sense, consider this quotation from Dictionary of National Biography:
  • "In 1779 he transferred the patent-medicine part of the business to the northeast corner of St. Paul's Churchyard, leaving the book publishing at the old spot." --Charles Welsh, DNB: Francis Newbery
(That article is one our biography Francis Newbery (publisher) incorporates heavily, with a general attribution.)
For another instance consider one Library of Congress note on a descendant publisher, located via VIAF:
(I don't know whether the association of numerical street address with apparently geographical description is provided by the stated source --"Brown, Philip A., London Publishers and Printers, c1800-1870, page 77."-- or whether Brown reports the content of some title page.)
Is that not a geographic description, presumably useful to one who walks to St Paul's in the 1880s without a map and finds no street signs or numbers? --P64 (talk) 18:31, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
P.S. I am in the US where Harvard University is convenient but I have limited privileges. Quickly locate this much on Philip A.H. Brown and his 1982 book: [2] [3] [4] --P64 (talk) 18:39, 15 November 2016 (UTC)
It's quite common in the old bits of London for the main street to have taken on the name of a geographical area and vice versa, Knightsbridge and Maida Vale are examples. So Ludgate Hill is both an actual hill (well, minor elevation) and the name of a street. So 2 Ludgate Hill is just an ordinary address on an ordinary street - and it's on the eastern end of that street, within spitting distance of the cathedral. St Paul's Churchyard is the same - it is now a streetname, and you can use the extent of that streetname in 1998 to get an idea of the area that gives the street its name. But yes, in your 2 Ludgate Hill example, it's being used as a geographical reference because the cathedral is such a major landmark and also to gain a little kudos from the proximity to the main publishing district even if they weren't actually on Paternoster Row.Le Deluge (talk) 22:04, 15 November 2016 (UTC)

Park articles

Per the discussion here, on a skim through the assorted subcategories of Category:Parks and open spaces in London there are huge numbers of articles (I'd guess at least 50%, rising to 80%+ for some outer boroughs) which are either completely unsourced, or where the source is just a link to the local council website to prove the park exists. While obviously some of these parks are going to be notable by Wikipedia standards, a lot more are just going to be a rectangle of grass and a football pitch, where the only coverage will be incidental "while walking her dog in the park…" mentions in the local papers, and reprints of "new daffodils planted" type press releases from the local council, and would be better served by being entries in a "List of open spaces in borough" list. Given how many there are, either bringing them up to scratch or deleting the Rise Park/Stationers Park type obvious no-hopers will be a Herculean task. If anyone's willing, going through any areas you're familiar with and cleaning up the most obviously problematic ones would probably be quite a good use of time. (If you don't fancy parks but feel like clearing out some dead wood, there are some real stinkers in Category:Grade II listed buildings in London and its subcategories as well; it looks suspiciously like someone's feeding the listed buildings register through an undeclared article-creation bot without stopping to check if the buildings in question have ever actually had significant coverage in any sources.) ‑ Iridescent 16:53, 8 December 2016 (UTC)

Agreed that not all public open spaces are likely to be notable. As for Grade II listed buildings, please see WP:GEOFEAT, "Artificial geographical features that are officially assigned the status of cultural heritage or national heritage, or of any other protected status on a national level and which verifiable information beyond simple statistics are available are presumed to be notable." Edwardx (talk) 11:38, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
@Iridescent: about the Grade II listed buildings, Edward is not an article creation bot (I've met him at several meet-ups), but he has created a number of articles on London pubs, streets, buildings and other locations over the last three or so years. See here. I lost count somewhere between 400 and 500. On counts of articles created, Edward has created 2,645. That might seem a lot, but I still feel a bit faint every time I see the numbers of non-redirect article creations at Wikipedia:List of Wikipedians by article count. I see Dr. Blofeld is at 96,778. I wonder what celebrations are planned for article creation number 100,000? Carcharoth (talk) 13:07, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
God help me, that guideline is even more ridiculous than WP:PORNBIO; is there any petty fiefdom left on Wikipedia that hasn't decided that too many of their pet articles are being deemed inappropriate so they're going to unilaterally opt out of the GNG? I strongly suspect that when that essay was written, they just hadn't thought the implications through; there are more than half a million listed buildings in England alone, and most of them are no more notable (and no more expandable) than 7 & 9 Bounds Green Road. By the logic of "listed at any level on a heritage register", this set of railings in Cambridge and this rock in Cornwall are independently notable. ‑ Iridescent 16:34, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
I'm unlikely to ever reach 100,000, I barely create articles these days. Yes, it's a scary figure, but in all honesty it's wildly inflated as a lot were pretty much placeholder entries when created. I just tried to set wikipedia on its way with broadening coverage globally and topics. I would be celebrating a lot more when wikipedia reaches 100,000 Good articles, put it that way.. A lot of listed buildings missing, thousands of notable ones missing, but not every one will be suitable for an article, in those cases the lists Peter has been creating are ideal.♦ Dr. Blofeld 17:44, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
@Dr. Blofeld: who is Peter? I agree about lists, see my comment below. Carcharoth (talk) 08:15, 10 December 2016 (UTC)
@Edwardx and Iridescent: I think the problem here is a guideline written by US editors not translating very well to other countries. Talking to USians they seem to think that Grade II should be a really big deal, whereas really Grade I is the closest equivalent to a federal heritage listing, and Grade II is closer to a more local listing. My vague impression is that WP:GNG equates to about 2/3 of the way down Grade II* - a lot of II* have independent coverage but not all of them, particularly ones which have spent most of their lives as private houses or outbuildings thereof. Plain Grade II generally appear not notable - on architectural grounds at least - but may be for other reasons. So I think the real issue is to globalise that guideline because it seems rather US-specific. As for parks - likewise, at a first approximation I'd say about half of them are GNG-able, but a lot of them really struggle. As with Grade II, list articles would appear the way to go, whilst bearing in mind that Wikipedia is not a WP:Gazetteer.Le Deluge (talk) 23:12, 13 December 2016 (UTC)
The US problem is not with federal lists but state one, which are taken as creating cast-iron notability. In many parts of the country that seems to mean any building from before 1920, and many from later. Any II* star should have an entry in Pevsner, one would have thought. Johnbod (talk) 04:42, 14 December 2016 (UTC)
  • It seems best to have separate pages for each park, building or whatever. That's because the various page elements like coordinates, images, infoboxes, categories, &c. work best when such places are treated individually rather than as a set or sub-set. A page about an individual place will link well to readers using smartphones which tend to highlight local features from GPS data. Consolidating separate locations into omnibus pages won't work so well because places in the same borough might be miles apart. If the resulting discrete pages are stubby, that's a feature rather than a bug because small pages are most suitable for the small screens of smartphones too. Andrew D. (talk) 18:02, 9 December 2016 (UTC)
    • "small pages are most suitable for the small screens of smartphones too" - that has to be one of the most ridiculous things I have read. Wikipedia is not Twitter. What happened to WP:NOTPAPER? When did that get replaced by WP:MOBILE? On geographic co-ordinates, lists are fine for that. You can still get all the places on a list on a map using something like {{GeoGroupTemplate}}. That is used on List of public art in the City of Westminster (it is below the lead image, I missed it first time round). If the links on that template don't work on smartphones, they should. Carcharoth (talk) 08:13, 10 December 2016 (UTC)
  • WP:NOTPAPER states

    "Wikipedia is not a paper encyclopedia, but a digital encyclopedia project. Other than verifiability and the other points presented on this page, there is no practical limit to the number of topics Wikipedia can cover ... Keeping articles to a reasonable size is important for Wikipedia's accessibility, especially for dial-up and mobile ... Splitting long articles and leaving adequate summaries is a natural part of growth"

For the Twitter experience, try using the Wikipedia app. This has trending topics and they are described quite succinctly, "John Glenn – American astronaut and politician"; "Regenerative brake - Energy recovery mechanism"; "Attack on Pearl Harbor – Military strike by the Imperial Japanese Navy". Even an FA only gets four lines of text which is little more than Twitter's limit of 140 characters. This limit comes from the research of Friedhelm Hillebrand who decided that it was "Perfectly sufficient". I started his article and it is still a stub. That's just fine for me because "enough is as good as a feast". Andrew D. (talk) 10:58, 10 December 2016 (UTC)
  • I doubt if I will be the one to write them, but there are several potential articles on parks in the borough I live in; and many many more parks that realistically will never merit an article. At least one of the parks is a WWII bombsite and really the article should be about the lost building with its destruction in one section and the current use in another. We shouldn't be too slavish about the English heritage lists. They may deem two tombs in a churchyard as needing a separate listing to the church and the adjacent War memorial gets grade II as an afterthought. I'd hope we'd at least start the article as being about a grade II* listed church with sections for the grade I listed tombs and grade II listed war memorial. ϢereSpielChequers 08:39, 10 December 2016 (UTC)
    Example (not London): Brookfield Unitarian Church, Peacock Mausoleum. --Redrose64 (talk) 23:28, 10 December 2016 (UTC)

CfD nomination of Category:Pubs in the London Borough of Barking & Dagenham

Category:Pubs in the London Borough of Barking & Dagenham has been nominated for renaming. You are encouraged to join the discussion on the Categories for discussion page. Ham II (talk) 13:41, 20 December 2016 (UTC)

The discussion has become about the larger topic of whether subcategories of, e.g., Category:London Borough of Barnet should be styled "Category:Foo in the London Borough of Barnet", "Category:Foo in Barnet" or "Category:Foo in Barnet (London borough)", so please weigh in if you have opinions on this. Ham II (talk) 16:46, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

Myke Hurley

Would someone from this WikiProject mind taking a look at Talk:Myke Hurley? It's a refunded prod and it's not clear (at least to me) if Hurley satifies WP:BIO since most of the sources seems to be primary or trivial mentions. Perhaps better sources exist, but they just have not yet been added to the article. Since Hurley appears to be from London, maybe someone from this WikiProject has heard of him and knows where to find these sources. Thanks in advance. -- Marchjuly (talk) 23:59, 31 December 2016 (UTC)

GA reassessment of Romney's House

Romney's House, an article that you or your project may be interested in, has been nominated for an individual good article reassessment. If you are interested in the discussion, please participate by adding your comments to the reassessment page. If concerns are not addressed during the review period, the good article status may be removed from the article. BlueMoonset (talk) 19:25, 18 January 2017 (UTC)

Town localities

Apologies if this has been discussed previously. I was a little surprised, as I suspect many others would be, to see towns such as Romford and Hornchurch described as being "in East London".
The postal addresses of anyone living in Romford is "Romford, Essex". I understand that it is technically in the London Borough of Havering, however, I believe few people would feel this as being "East London". Certainly, the "E" postcode district is nowhere near as far out as Romford.
Would this town, and similar others, be better described as being "in Greater London", rather than "in East London"? Perhaps a rule of thumb could be that if the town's postcode is "E" then it is "in East London" (eg Stratford) but if it is "RM" or "IG" etc then it is "in Greater London" (eg Upminster). --TBM10 (talk) 12:37, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

There is no single and simple definition of London (see the protracted arguments over the term on the talk page of the London article). Historically, these towns were in Essex until the formation of Greater London in 1965 (there is a section that addresses this issue in the Greater London article in fact). The problem mainly arises due to the differences between the "London" postal district and the Greater London area.
I think that, for most general uses these days, "London" means "Greater London" and "East London" means that part of Greater London that is the historic East End and the areas to its east. Similarly, our usual meaning of "North London" include those areas that were formerly in Middlesex and Hertfordshire, "West London" includes the former parts of Middlesex and Buckinghamshire and "South London" includes the former parts of Surrey and Kent.
Classification solely by postcode does not help particularly, as some former county postcodes areas cover places that are outside Greater London. The RM postcode area for example includes areas of Thurrock out as far as Tilbury. I grew-up in south-west London living in the SM post code area with the edge of the SW area at the end of my road. I always considered the place I lived to be part of London even though it was for post still in Surrey.
--DavidCane (talk) 14:07, 4 February 2017 (UTC)

Notice to participants at this page about adminship

Many participants here create a lot of content, may have to evaluate whether or not a subject is notable, decide if content complies with BLP policy, and much more. Well, these are just some of the skills considered at Wikipedia:Requests for adminship.

So, please consider taking a look at and watchlisting this page:

You could be very helpful in evaluating potential candidates, and even finding out if you would be a suitable RfA candidate.

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Anna Frodesiak (talk) 01:07, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Subcategories of London Boroughs

Please see WP:CFD 2017 February 10#Subcategories_of_London_Boroughs, where I have proposed renaming 596 sub-categories of Category:London boroughs. (Yes, 596 sub-categories). This discussion is part of Wikipedia:Categories for discussion, and Wikipedia:Category names is probably the most relevant guideline.

All the categories fall within the scope of this project, so participation by members of this project would be very welcome. Please add your comnets at the CFD page, not here. --BrownHairedGirl (talk) • (contribs) 22:24, 10 February 2017 (UTC)

Trade tokens in the Portable Antiquities Scheme

There are a lot of newly-uploaded pics of old trade tokens from London pubs, in:

Commons:Category:Trade tokens in the Portable Antiquities Scheme

Please make use of them where you can. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 14:02, 12 February 2017 (UTC)

Queen(')s Road Peckham

I have started a discussion about redirects to Queens Road Peckham railway station and the road it is named for at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject London Transport#Queen(')s Road Peckham. Your comments are invited there. Thryduulf (talk) 21:40, 21 April 2017 (UTC)

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Bottle match

Hi WP London, this is notice that the article Bottle match is currently nominated for deletion, Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Bottle match. I feel there must be some reliable sources to support an article about the 'second oldest varsity rugby match' and maybe your project can help. Aloneinthewild (talk) 10:31, 7 May 2017 (UTC)

Perhaps a subsection on Sport in London would be an appropriate solution. Jackiespeel (talk) 22:52, 16 May 2017 (UTC)

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