This is an archive of past discussions with User:Gwafton. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
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On 20 April 2015, Did you know was updated with a fact from the article Sisu KB-124, which you recently created or substantially expanded. The fact was ... that the 1.85-metre (6 ft 1 in) deck width of the Sisu KB-124(pictured) was agile, but was considered problematic because two standard pallets could not fit? The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Sisu KB-124. You are welcome to check how many page hits the article got while on the front page (here's how, live views, daily totals), and it may be added to the statistics page if the total is over 5,000. Finally, if you know of an interesting fact from another recently created article, then please feel free to suggest it on the Did you know talk page.
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Short answer: Occupied Estonia. There's no policy, but general facts. Baltic states were occupied. Articles about someone born in France 1940 don't use Deutsches Reich as birthplace. Take a minute and read this: Occupation of the Baltic states. Especially this part: "The Baltic states, the United States and its courts of law, the European Parliament, the European Court of Human Rights and the United Nations Human Rights Council have all stated that these three countries were invaded, occupied and illegally incorporated into the Soviet Union under provisions of the 1939 Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact, first by the Soviet Union, then by Nazi Germany from 1941 to 1944, and again by the Soviet Union from 1944 to 1991. This policy of non-recognition has given rise to the principle of legal continuity, which holds that de jure, or as a matter of law, the Baltic states had remained independent states under illegal occupation throughout the period from 1940 to 1991." There are miles of discussions about this [1], [2], [3]. etc. Inform me if you want more. Klõps (talk) 19:57, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
In this particular case I would use as a birthplace France (zone occupée). France was annexed de facto, but not de jure. Regarding Soviet Estonia, it was no doubt a part of Soviet Union de facto, but as there was no other functioning leadership (as Estonian government-in-exile had no political power in Estonia back then), the actual ruling entity was Estonian SSR. Whether Soviet annexation was sealed in Helsinki Declaration, is controversial. As there is no policy for expressing the political entities in the Soviet Baltic states, maybe we should have such.
Poland is another story... and I think this kind of pipelinking goes against general guidelines.
Government in Exile by its definition can't have power in the country it has been exiled or else it would not be government in exile!?
Vichy France was de jure recognized by most Axis and neutral powers, including USA... at least until 1942.
Baltic states were occupied and illegally annexed. They never disappeared, but continued to exist de jure, because sovereign title was never transferred to the respective occupying power, and thus their identity continued to be preserved throughout the period of illegal annexation. Read more State continuity of the Baltic states. That's why this far policy has been that other Soviet Republics are used as birth places and Baltic states, as not recognized republics, are not.Klõps (talk) 21:31, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
During the World War 2 there were number of cases when different countries broke against international law and conventions. It doesn't matter who is wrong and who is right, the only thing that counts is that who is stronger. In this point of view, the legal status of the Soviet presence in the Baltic States is quite irrelevant. I suggest you to open a discussion about the policy how to refer to the Baltic States in the Soviet era. I think we need a general guideline for this. --Gwafton (talk) 22:07, 4 November 2015 (UTC)
Disambiguation link notification for November 8
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