Hi there, my name's Peter Coombe and I'm a Wikimedia Community Fellow working on a project to improve Wikipedia's help system. At the moment I'm trying to learn more about how people use and find the current help pages. If you could help by filling out this brief survey about your experiences, I'd be very grateful. It should take less than 10 minutes, and your responses will not be tied to your username in any way.
Thank you for you attention to this article. Closing the spaces around em-dashes is to my mind a matter of taste, but I have no strong objection to your doing so. However, care must be taken in this process. In the case of the wikilink below (shown first without double brackets):
Pierson's Puppeteers#Homeworld — The Fleet of Worlds|Puppeteers' secret home system
This has the effect of breaking the secondary link, so that the link as a whole goes to the primary target (Pierson's Puppeteers) only. I'll go through the other em-dashes in the article to make sure there are no similar cases.
Oops. I didn't mean to break the link, but deleting spaced em dashes isn't a matter of opinion—it's a matter of the Manual of Style: spaced em dashes have been deprecated for some time.
Do not use spaced em dashes.
Another "planet" was detected — but it was later found to be a moon of Saturn.
There is a discussion in the Talk:CBS Records page which I'm asking you to get involved in. As you may know, the former CBS Records label is now Columbia Records and the former CBS Records company is now Sony Music. Someone wants to add more material about the former CBS Records in the current CBS Records article which is not connected in any way with the old CBS Records. Steelbeard1 (talk) 18:22, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]
While I don't disagree with you, I have never edited that article, and have no investment in it, so I am wondering: why me? Additionally, I have no interest in being involved in an edit war.—DocWatson42 (talk) 19:49, 25 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Please refrain from gratuitously removing intra-paragraph newlines, as you did at IBM Selectric typewriter. These do not render in the presentation, so removing them has no effect on the displayed pages. However some Wikipedia editors prefer to put a newline between sentences within a paragraph. This de-clutters the edit window and thereby makes editing easier and less error-prone. You may disagree with this opinion (see WP:NEWLINE for an essay describing both positions), and that is fine for text you originate, but it is generally against WP guidelines to change existing article formatting purely as a matter of your personal preference. Jeh (talk) 05:03, 3 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
I had not realized that it was a purposeful editing strategy—I only thought it was something done by new/unskilled editors, possibly back when the editing window was much smaller (early 2000s).—DocWatson42 (talk) 05:11, 3 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, it's definitely a personal style. I also use it in markup languages like LaTeX or HTML (or Runoff in the old days), and for similar reasons. Thanks for the reply. Jeh (talk) 08:14, 3 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
First, many thanks for your help at Jewish holidays! Your attention to such detail is laudable!
Second, I will change back at minimum one of your adjustments. I have no problem with your having changed the date formats from
Holiday name – Hebrew date
to
Holiday name: Hebrew date
However, in the case of Hanukkah, the dates run from 25 Kislev through 2 or 3 Tevet. This is why that date was written "25 Kislev–2 or 3 Tevet," although I think there were unnecessary spaces padding the dash. However, I will restore that dash, which you had changed to "25 Kislev: 2 or 3 Tevet."
The other thing I noticed is that you changed all of the occurrences of "something-in-quotes-followed-by-comma-inside," to "something-in-quotes", comma outside. When I was taught punctuation in school, I was taught to place the comma inside always, and I do so. At the moment, I'm the principal editor of this article, so as long as I'm consistent, I'd appreciate it if you'd allow me to honor my junior high school and high school teachers on this particular point.
You're welcome. ^_^ As for the date, I was changing dashes to colons in bunches (in part to eliminate the forbidden spaced em dashes), so I must not have noticed the date was a range (sorry!); though per MOS:ENDASH, ranges which include a space should use a spaced en dash. As for the quotations, I was following MOS:LQ—see especially the second example and its explanation.
So I guess I should say "25 Kislev – 2 or 3 Tevet"?
As far as MOS:LQ goes, the way it looked to me, the "consensus" quoted there seems weak at best, highly driven by opinion and bias, and not uniformly practiced anyway. So with all due respect, I'm sticking with "TQ," or "American style," in this article. (FWIW, LQ just absolutely, positively, looks wrong to my eye.) StevenJ81 (talk) 18:39, 26 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]
This is now the second occasion in which you have replaced all the spaced EN dashes in the article Professional wrestling in the United Kingdom with unspaced EM dashes, even though, as I am sure you are aware, under MOS:DASHeither one is acceptable, it being only spaced EM dashes which are forbidden.
Bearing this in mind, I note that on both occasions you did not provide an explanation of the MOS criteria for making this change, the second time despite having been asked by myself the previous time!
I notice from the rest of your talkpage that you have a good reputation for resolving dash and puncutation issues on Wikipedia. For this reason, I am most loathe to go down the route of the vandalism procedure. However, if you are not prepared to discuss your reasons for this unnecessary modification and continue to make the change, I feel I shall have no recourse but to escalate the issue..
In the hope that such conflict can be avoided, please respond explaining your reasons for replacing the perfectly Wiki-acceptable spaced EN dashes on this article.
First, I did not notice that you had reverted my previous edit. I was actually on the page to correct the spelling of "vieing" to "vying" (I've recently adopted it as one of the typos I pursue), and when I went back to make certain that I had caught all instances within Wikipedia, I thought (when I edited the page the second time) that a new instance of misspelling been made, so fixed it, along with the other minor problems on the page.
Anyway, I'm afraid you're mistaken—there were no en dashes on the page prior to my edits, spaced or not. There were only spaced hyphens, which, like spaced em dashes, are not allowed ("Do not use substitutes for em or en dashes, such as the combination of two hyphens (--)."). I thus (both times) changed them to my preference, em dashes. Check for yourself—pull up the page in question, type an en dash (–) into your browser's search box, and try to find one. Then try to find a spaced hyphen (" - "). The only en dashes on the page are in the British wrestling titles navbox, and even that needed to have some hyphens replaced with en dashes before I wrote this.—DocWatson42 (talk) 15:46, 11 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Very well - I have been through the article myself and replaced all the spaced hyphens with spaced EN dashes as copied and pasted directly from your response above. I trust this will resolve the matter to both our satisfaction.
As an aside, while I appreciate you are entitled to your preference for long EM dashes, moving forward, it may be helpful to consider that in cases such as this where spaced hyphens are used, the actual intention was spaced EN dashes. Just a thought... 195.92.109.20 (talk) 18:13, 11 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Actually, I feel that since I was the first editor with a correct punctuation, done in good faith, my preference should stand—though I won't engage in an edit war over it. I find your preemptive imposition of your preference a bit presumptuous, especially since, unlike you put in the comment of you edit of the article in question, we had not finished discussing the matter. Also, while I will keep your second point in mind, spaced hyphens are still against the rules, and I will continue to correct them, since I can't divine whether they are as you describe them, or just spaced hyphens.—DocWatson42 (talk) 20:07, 11 February 2013 (UTC)[reply]
If you can fix this redirect to point to an existing Wikipedia page, please do so and remove the speedy deletion tag. However, please do not remove the speedy deletion tag unless you also fix the redirect. Feel free to leave a note on my talk page if you have any questions about this. - Camyoung54talk19:02, 16 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I was referring to #1. I did go to MOS:ENDASH, but it says, "In compounds when the connection might otherwise be expressed with to, versus, and, or between." I don't think any of those can be said for award + winning. If I'm missing something please explain. --Musdan77 (talk) 04:03, 10 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
See Dash#Attributive compounds ("Pulitzer Prize–winning novel"). The MOS "3. Instead of a hyphen, when applying a prefix (but not a suffix) to a compound that includes a space" apparently replaced this version some time before November 2011. -_-; (Why, I don't know, as ISTM that suffixes and their kin should, in this case, be treated the same as prefixes, and why Wikipedia should be different from the rest of the world.)—DocWatson42 (talk) 04:39, 10 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]
June 2013
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and future ranch |first=Scott |last=Timberg |date=October 20, 2005 |work=[[Los Angeles Times]]}}}</ref> Ranch style houses are occasionally still built today, but mainly in the Western states and,
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:—Corneille, ''Le Cid'' Act IV , scene 3)</poem></blockquote>
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as well as an ever-increasing range of aircraft. Most kits were created at the "standard" scale of {{frac|1|72} for small and military aircraft, and {{frac|1|144}} scale for airliners.<ref>Most of
Likewise, some MPC auto kits were sold in the UK under the Airfix name (an example being the {{frac|1|25} scale vintage [[Stutz Bearcat]] kit originally produced as a tie-in to the ''[[Bearcats!
steering geometry|Ackermann]] steering, they also later made conversion kits so that normal Airfix {{frac|1|32} kit cars such as the Ford Zodiac and the Sunbeam Rapier could be made to race. The
Fort kit. Collectors of vintage toy soldiers have reported brittling and disintegration of Airfix {{frac|1|76} scale plastic figures, though not as an age related effect<ref>{{cite web|url=http://
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members-a-first/ | title =Senate: Two Black Members a First | author =Gregory Giroux | publisher=[[Bloomberg L.P.|Bloomberg | date =January 30, 2013}}</ref> Cowan's Senate term officially began on
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]. In other regions and outside of Italy it is common to find lasagne made with [[ricotta]] or [[mozzarella] cheese, [[tomato sauce]], various meats (e.g., ground beef, pork or chicken), and
Hi there, I'm wondering if there is a reason Template:Regions of New York needs to be directly below the Infobox on the New York City article. It pushes the accompanying images down, leading to both a stackup, and sandwiching below, particularly if a reader has the TOC minimized. Since it was a geography template, I thought it might fit much better under External links, where many Geography navboxes can be found on similar articles. Would that work?-- Patrick, oѺ∞18:21, 4 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]
I do so because it makes it easier to determine what categories are and are not already applied to the article. Also, other than a "primary" category ("Category:Article name"), how is it possible to determine what is a "more important" category than something else?—DocWatson42 (talk) 06:04, 26 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]
July 2013
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side effects. Scientists isolated the problem: the [[P-glycoprotein|Multi Drug Resistant 1]] ([[MDR1) gene. In addition, more than 30 potentially toxic drugs have been identified, and a lab test
Gooday - you changed a hyphen into an "em dash" here. I don't know what an em dash is, and IMO it was originally correct, but now - again IMO - the dash needs a clear space before and after.
Doc, we have enough trouble with dash phobia without overusing them where a hyphen is appropriate. I reverted a couple of your recent ones. Speak up here if you think there's a justification for any of those per MOS:DASH. Dicklyon (talk) 05:57, 18 July 2013 (UTC)[reply]
"The MOS is not a policy, it's a guideline and should be followed when it's best to do so, and not when it is in opposition to the rules of punctuation."
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2010 |title=Game Changers: How Videogames Trained a Generation of Athletes |journal=[[Wired (magazine|Wired]] |volume=18 |issue=2 |url=http://www.wired.com/magazine/2010/01/ff_gamechanger/all/
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', ''Looney Tunes: Cartoon Conductor'')<br />[[Eric Goldberg (film director)|Eric Goldberg]] (''[[Looney Tunes: Back in Action]]'' (2003–present)<br />[[Bob Bergen]] (''[[Bah, Humduck! A Looney
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28/opinion/sunday/dowd-time-to-hard-delete-carlos-danger.html "Time to Hard-Delete Carlos Danger"]]. ''The New York Times'', July 27, 2013.</ref> Following this admission, there were calls for
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Fleece]]. They are two immense [[Bull (mythology)|bulls]] with bronze hooves, and bronze mouths] through which they breathe fire. In the ''[[Argonautica]]'', Jason is promised the prized fleece
Why can't references go in one References sec like Malleus does it (e.g. Sunbeam Tiger#References)? I don't see how/why a reader would access the Reference subsecs through the TOC, only thru article links. Doesn't that just add length and clutter unnecessarily to the TOC? Also, why do you prefer ;xxx over '''xxx''', on my screen the latter seems slighly better. Ihardlythinkso (talk) 07:06, 29 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
a Latino street gang, of which [[List of Sons of Anarchy characters#Nero Padilla|Nero Padilla]] ([[Jimmy Smits]]} is the leader. Introduced in Season 5.
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be transformed—similar to OFDR technology—back into a spatial profile, e.g. by [cross-correlation]]. In contrast to OFDR technology, the emission is finite (for example 128 bit) which avoids that
I work with Krug and am currently involved in a project concerning Wikipedia. Few month ago I've proposed on the talk page of Champagne Krug in english an improved version of this article. That was well-validated by one of the contribs of the Champagne Krug article: Agne27
I will like to know if this article is ok for you too? If it's Ok could you please publish the version that Krug suggests.
Hey, I have moved most of the files you requested. In future, could you please add the rename tag to the top of the actual file page, instead of the file talk page, as that would make the process a bit quicker? Thanks. Widr (talk) 06:02, 31 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks! I didn't add the tag to the main pages because I received an error message telling me to place the template on the talk page. E.g., when I place {{rename|lalala.jpg|Just because.}} on File:French-power-socket.jpg, I receive the error:
(In red:) This template must be substituted. Replace {{Requested move ...}} with {{subst:Requested move ...}}.
Which, when I comply, is followed by
Template:Requested move must be used in a TALKSPACE, e.g., File talk:French-power-socket.jpg
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in May 2007.<ref>{{cite news |title=People Magazine's 'Most Beautiful People' issue |publisher=[[CBS News] |url=http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/042507_people_list_facts.pdf |accessdate=11 April
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Me: "Away from the guy, not towards him."{{sfn|Gretzky|Reilly|1990|p=88}}}}</poem></blockquote>
Yes that is true, but two points to consider. The first is that without the Attribution then the usual place to put the references would be in the alphabetical position of the author's surname. The attribution prescript makes that positioning look odd (aesthetically displeasing). The second point is that a number of prominent and influential editors disprove of copying PD text into an article (as is done in that one) so as a compromise, worked out a couple of years ago, it was agreed that references to copying should be clearly marked so that it was clear to everyone where the text originated and that it had been copied, (as plagiarism is the surreptitious copying of anthers text then PD text marked as copied can not be plagiarism). -- PBS (talk) 08:38, 26 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]
IP editor on breast related articles
Hi DocWatson42,
I saw your message at 173.161.79.242's talk page. I noticed their edit after they revert my edit on the article of breast augmentation for no reason whatsoever (see diff). Apparently, a lot of their edits concern reverting. I've given them a lvl 2 warning for their unconstructive editing. --Soetermans. T / C11:02, 11 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]
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* ''[[Bol (film)|Bol]]'' (30 August 2011) (Released
That would make sense if there were other links there for regular pages. It doesn't make sense to create an entire section to house a portal, which can easily reside next to the other similar links. It's unnecessary sectioning. It would be the equivalent of creating a "Writing" subsection under the "Production" header for a single sentence on the writing of a film. The guideline also says, "Do not make a section whose sole content is box-type templates." BIGNOLE (Contact me)22:46, 29 January 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I'm sorry, I don't watch your page, so I didn't see your response. Under "Links to sister projects", on the very guideline you cite, it says, "Do not make a section whose sole content is a box-type template". I.E. Portals would not be in "See also" sections when they are the only thing there. BIGNOLE (Contact me)12:04, 11 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
<shrug> I respond where the message is, not spread across multiple pages, so that the discussion is coherent. (E.g., I'd forgotten that this section was here, and was only following up on my message on your talk page.) As for the rule, I only see it in the External links section, and that there is an exception to it which allows for standalone links. I really don't understand the practical difference between an inline link and standard box link.—DocWatson42 (talk) 12:58, 11 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Portals are really just navigation templates. They take you to overall, similar topics (not 1 specific similar page). Thus, portals belong next to the other nav boxes, and not in the "Similar pages" section. BIGNOLE (Contact me)10:28, 27 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
In the section that I quoted for you about housing nothing but a box in the "See also" section. If you're just trying to redirect people to a portal, it's hardly a "related link". Just being a "Superhero portal" does not mean that the page itself is similar to the film "Man of Steel". The Superhero portal is just a mini-Wikipedia about superheroes. BIGNOLE (Contact me)13:20, 28 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Again, I only see that rule in the External links section, and that there is an exception to it which allows for standalone links. Also, a portal is an internal link, not an external one, as to other Wikimedia projects.—DocWatson42 (talk) 18:14, 28 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
It's the same principal rule that you don't create an entire section just to house a navigation box. When you're just dealing a standalone portal, put it with the other boxes. You don't create sections just to house navigation boxes, whether that's external or internal links. If you did, then the layout guideline would not say, "many high-quality and comprehensive articles do not have a "See also" section.", as you can find a portal for just about every article we have. BIGNOLE (Contact me)03:03, 31 March 2014 (UTC)[reply]
and ambassador [[Perle Mesta]].<ref>http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,939326,00.html]</ref> [[George H.W. Bush]] also lived in the neighborhood prior to his White House years.
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]), ["Dingell's Grand Inquisitor Politics"], ''The Wall Street Journal'', November 25, 2008]: accessed November 25, 2008.</ref> He has subpoenaed numerous government officials to testify
built the base at [[Inchtuthil]]. In AD 88 the legion returned south and occupied Castra Devena ([[Deva Victrix]]_, where it remained for at least two centuries.
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Image:WeaponAlfa.jpg|A dismounted launcher seen at the [[Intrepid Sea-Air-Space Museum]]]].
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of links only work for US bridges, and remainder are available from coords shown at top of page.)-->
evidence of powderpuff football being played as early as 1931 at Western State College of Colorado] (now Western State Colorado University) in Gunnison, Colorado. <ref>{{cite web|last=Barker|first=
Re: your edit, {{Portal bar}}'s documentation specifically prefers the bottom of the page, so creating a brand new See also section is unnecessary (and a less elegant solution) czar ♔04:22, 16 April 2014 (UTC)[reply]
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|coauthors=Nadia Damouni |date=24 September 2012 |publisher=[[Reuters]] |accessdate=18 May 2014}}]</ref>
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the two characters [[Kaguya]] and Mokou have drank the "Hourai Elixir" which is the elixir of life].
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same hand, the contest lengthens to 1500 points. This rule holds regardless of score fluctuations (players "going minus" - failing to reach their bid amounts — and falling below 1000 points.
I was looking at the latest edit to Edmund Wilson in which an editor made the text of the quote (of the form-postcard that Wilson would often send out) italicized. When I looked at it in the article, it looked a little strange to me, italics inside a pair of large blue quotation marks. I'm not well-versed in this type of formatting, so I decided to look at the WP:MoS for quotes, at WP:Blockquote, and I read that those large blue quotation marks are for what is called "pullquotes" (and there is a link to that template from the blockquotes section). At the page for the template on pullquotes, it says that pullquotes are for material that is already in the text of the article. I may have missed it, but I didn't see the text of the form-postcard in the text of the article. If it isn't there, then regular blockquote format should be used. And I don't think italics are used for the text of a blockquote, either. Do you want to look into this and make any necessary changes? CorinneSD (talk) 00:18, 9 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Pull quotes look nice and are eye catching, so in practice they are often used instead of regular block quotes. They also seem to include the <poem> function as a matter of course, which is useful as (at least in my ancient browser) <blockquote> has a bug in which the carriage returns between the first and second paragraph of a two-paragraph quote are ignored (quotes of three or more paragraphs are fine). E.g.,
lahdidah
lahdidah
versus
lahdidah
lahdidah
lahdidah
Still, since you asked (and nicely, too ^_^), I fixed the quotation to follow the MOS, and cleaned up the cited reference (the generic title made me check the link, and I found that it was dead).—DocWatson42 (talk) 03:29, 9 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]
I think those big blue quotation marks look nice, too, but I thought it was advisable to follow the Mos. I guess they don't want to overdo the big blue quotation marks. I think they take up more space than a regular block quote does. CorinneSD (talk) 15:10, 9 June 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Reference Errors on 2 July
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* [[List of anime by release date|Pre-1930]—A single page containing a descending list of releases
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Cars.jpg|thumb|180px|right|Screenshot of the Thunder Alley Pro cars during the initial pace lap.]]
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# "Midsummer Mirage" (真夏の蜃気楼（そのままじゃん) "Manatsu no Shinkirō (Sono Mama Jan)")
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McCarthy, Helen]]. ''500 Essential Anime Movies: The Ultimate Guide''. Harper Design, 2009. [. 498. ISBN 978-0061474507.</ref>
Please only add one link to Anime News Network's encyclopedia. If a link is already there, only check to see if it is the base media. This is so that the article complies with WP:EL and we are not spamming links in the external link section. —Farix (t | c) 10:42, 7 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Farix: I acknowledge that I may have been a bit over enthusiastic in adding links. However, it is not apparent to the casual Wikipedia user that the ANN Encyclopedia entries are linked to each other, and the user may pass the manga link by because it (apparently) does not relate to the anime. Placing the anime link in the Wikipedia article makes it clear to the user that there is a specific entry in the ANN Encyclopedia, something that is not always the case. Also, I tried to add multiple anime entry links only when they were not linked to each other, but only to the manga entry.—DocWatson42 (talk) 04:17, 9 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Hey, Doc! Thanks for all your clean-up efforts on bare refs, but just a friendly reminder: please use U.S. date format for American TV shows. Otherwise, you leave another mess for another editor to clean up, as I had to do with List of White Collar episodes this morning. --Drmargi (talk) 16:49, 3 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Drmargi: I'm sorry for your trouble. I had been under the impression that date formats were like nationally-neutral subjects and em dashes versus spaced en dashes: the first format to be used in an article was the "correct" one. Since "List of White Collar episodes" already had a dd-mm-yyyy for an access date, I assumed that was the "correct" format, so that's what I used.—DocWatson42 (talk) 06:35, 15 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]
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and later familiar to television viewers as ''[[The Millionaire (TV series)|The Millionaire]]''{{-']}s presenter and executive secretary, Michael Anthony—was [[Marvin Miller (actor)|Marvin Miller]].
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"Auschwitz: The Nazis and the Final Solution" Yesterday television channel, 18:00, 18 November 2013]</ref> After the war, the diary of the Auschwitz Commandant, [[Rudolf Höss]], revealed that
prisoners (''Häftlinge'') to [[Sobibór extermination camp|Sobibór]] in November 1943]]
