This is an archive of past discussions with User:DUCKISJAMMMY, for the period 1 January 2012 to 31 March 2012. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.
I agree there needs to be a cut off however I think a season is appropriate. He was only released in September so not that long ago. The best way to handle it would be with a footnote for the player. For ones after a season it would be free agent to the spl or first division club. EdinburghWanderer09:06, 6 January 2012 (UTC)
well what would you think the cut of would be as we're talking 4 months here there are a lot of other players on both lists that would need to be removed if we are talking less than that. The footnote is not difficult all it needs to say is he was released by Ross county on September 2011. EdinburghWanderer09:41, 6 January 2012 (UTC)
I see where your coming from now. My personal opinion is it should be included but u could go eithier way with it. Given how comprehensive we've made the lists this year it would be a shame not to include it. If we don't then we need to add a note to the header saying we don't include people who were released during previous transfer window. But what about players like Janos Balogh at hearts he was released on December so last window and then will sign for a new club this window. I think there will be a lot we won't include. EdinburghWanderer10:19, 6 January 2012 (UTC)
Ok. Just so you know I'll be away from Tuesday untill early Sunday next week in case your looking for me. I'll reply to talk messages though. EdinburghWanderer12:27, 6 January 2012 (UTC)
Gray
I was waiting untill he made his first division debut. But will probably move tonight. At the hearts game and will do season articles tonight when i get back Some of the hearts players are making their debuts tonight as well so will probably move them. It's against a junior team but the cups notable so just going to risk it. EdinburghWanderer14:48, 7 January 2012 (UTC)
Hearts played a very weakened team at one point we had two strikers in defence. I will add it got about five. I've asked jmorrison if i can add his so will do it all when he replies. EdinburghWanderer17:27, 7 January 2012 (UTC)
Fleetwood Town are a fully professional football club. All their players, including Matty Hughes are full time (therefore professional) football players. Veganfishcake (talk) 15:38, 8 January 2012
In which case please don't state that a professional football club aren't professional just because the league they play in isn't fully professional. Fleetwood Town are in their second season as a professional club. Veganfishcake (talk) 15:48, 8 January 2012
Hi DUCKISJAMMMY. After reviewing your request for rollback, I have enabled rollback on your account. Keep in mind these things when going to use rollback:
Getting rollback is no more momentous than installing Twinkle.
If you no longer want rollback, contact me and I'll remove it. Also, for some more information on how to use rollback, see Wikipedia:New admin school/Rollback (even though you're not an admin). I'm sure you'll do great with rollback, but feel free to leave me a message on my talk page if you run into troubles or have any questions about appropriate/inappropriate use of rollback. Thank you for helping to reduce vandalism. Happy editing! SalvioLet's talk about it!13:45, 11 January 2012 (UTC)
Could you please sort this out on the main Queen of the South page for me please? I deleted Roddy McKenzie from the squad list yesterday and the message below is showing red in error. Many Thanks. (RJC 15:56, 12 January 2012 (UTC))
Hey
Just so you know I'll be back late tommorow like eleven and will do the hearts season article and then on Sunday and that are left. On a lighter not thanks for starting the Watford discussion what a kettle of fish that opened up. Only kidding. EdinburghWanderer15:07, 8 January 2012 (UTC)
I wasnt even sure you had got the message. I've got a lot of problems with the airdrie stats in they aren't matching what I thought I would find ive used the match reports for each one but I'm actually rather concerned about it. If it wasn't because I need it to remove te stats of the main page I would just leave it. In most it's ok but on others it just dosent match soccerway or soccerbase and others. I'm unsure how to proceed what was the problem you found. In regards to the new template I hate it on looks but technically it isn't up to scratch at all and I I'm unsure they even looked at very closely hence it's gone all defensive.EdinburghWanderer16:34, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
do you think I'm making to much of a fuss over the styling to me it just looks awfull but I appear to be the only one who cares about it. if it would split it wouldnt be so bad. EdinburghWanderer16:50, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
my problem is they wind me up they clearly think that how it looks isn't a problem and clearly never even thought about it. The mobile device argument is crap, they may have a point about screen readers but I can't prove it and not convinced they even checked that. Anyway I'm going to let them get on with it. There not listening anyway. What was it you found in the airdrie stats. EdinburghWanderer17:02, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
yeah it look bad without the squad numbers. I would like to bring that up but they think I'm making a nuisance of my self so will see how discussion goes and then maybe comment if need me. Hopefully they will come to that conclusion eventually. EdinburghWanderer17:05, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
i dont have much time for it eithier but over the last week I am attracting it between this and vandalism. If you want I'll re count the Stats for the page but that takes a long time or just his I may have counted the reports wrong but I'm finding it on then all. It's actually doing my head in the season pages are easy but the stats are taking me days to do and finding I dont have the concentration for doing all the matches of a season. Although one of the older ones I counted twice and it still didn't match what I thought it should. EdinburghWanderer17:28, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
i don't know what source I used possibly airdrie mad if I struggled. Don't really know what to do about it. I don't trust the sources and I can't keep recounting it every time. I'm tempted to give up on the main page as its too much hastle and create the season articles without stats. Did you find a source for the match. EdinburghWanderer17:45, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
ok I'm limited to what I can look at but airdrie mad have no data for the match, one source has nothing and the other dosent mention the subs im unsure where I got the stats from unless I didn't do the subs which would explain Donnelly. I'll give it a good look when I get home but out of interest did you find a source for that match. it won't take long to check the league stats as I'm just looking for one player. EdinburghWanderer17:52, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
ok that's probably what I've done in regard to league stats it's eithier a simple mistake or correct and stats sites are wrong as I say will look into tommorow night unless you have done already in which case you can let me know. EdinburghWanderer18:05, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
Ive been thinking I have 4 and a half hour train journey at 5 tommorow night so will count his stats only whilst on the train and if I've got them wrong then I suppose I will have to recount everybody's. I've mentioned the squad number about the table. You should put what you think in and then just ignore that's what I'm now planning in doing. They probably won't pay any attention anyway. EdinburghWanderer19:11, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
that's better than what I do. I do it like I'm updating the table after every match it takes for ever but It appeared to be mostly accurate. I've moved it will sort when I'm back at hotel I hadnt realised there was a game tonight was going to check tommorow. Thank soft letting me know would have been gutted if it had been created. . EdinburghWanderer20:41, 13 January 2012 (UTC)
and the award for most watchfull Wikipedian goes to Duckisjammy. 17 appearances is correct. Before anyone else notices I rechecked mark Ridgers as his didn't match and his stats were correct on page not on soccerbase. I will cross ref with stats sites and check any that look wrong. Its probably only him other than the Scottish cup subs which will need added. EdinburghWanderer18:47, 14 January 2012 (UTC)
Cool you've done a good job with Dundee. I will fix the Airdrie 2010-11 season page tomorrow.. It was easy to work out Donnelly in the end only took about ten minutes. Id thought about creating an article on him before but I've too much to be getting on with. I start things and don't finish them so really want to get the Airdrie ones all done and then sort out the Hearts squad some of them need a lot of work. I was hoping some would leave to lessen the load but thats not happening. One question for you do you think it would be rude to add another users new articles to the new articles page. Ive asked Jmorrison three times and explained why we need to add them but don't even get any reply.EdinburghWanderer01:59, 15 January 2012 (UTC)
He's created loads even going further back some aren't even tagged correctly I will just do it. I asked him months ago and he never replied and again this time. Thats really funny i have to say i question how they got through the RFA. Its not easy and some of the questions they ask are traps if they think tags are ugly and vandalism.EdinburghWanderer02:20, 15 January 2012 (UTC)
His contract with Hearts was allowed to expire early on 1 January the same day his loan deal with Dundee finished. I believe he is trying to find a new club. In the press the other day it was said dundee are trying to get him on a non fixed deal until he finds a new club but not heard any more.EdinburghWanderer21:15, 15 January 2012 (UTC)
This is how the new template would look like if used on the Hearts page.[1] Obviously header colour would need to be changed to make it more readable. Although i don't like the length the ability to put the photos down the side i do.EdinburghWanderer22:14, 16 January 2012 (UTC)
Unfortunately i am having to go away again this weekend. Will be back Sunday night. Feel free just to leave the season articles and i will start on sunday evening or do whats not been done.EdinburghWanderer16:07, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
just so you know in regards to Calum Elliot he has joined a Lithuanian club on a two year deal. Only the second Scotsman to play in Lithuania behind Craig Thomson. There is a source on his article of you want to add it to the transfer list. Unfortunately it's in Lithuanian. EdinburghWanderer22:21, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
what's more peculiar is he turned down an offer to go on trial with Houston Dynamos in America. This should be the last weekend for a long time being sent everywhere at the moment. I genuinely wouldnt worry about the season articles they can wait a few days. The Scottish ones are the only ones that get done so quickly. If you do any leave the third and second ill do all them on Sunday night and Monday night after work. It's time I pulled my weight again.EdinburghWanderer22:38, 20 January 2012 (UTC)
I'll only get maybe two done tonight just due to the flights bound to be delyed out of Heathrow. I will do the rest after work tomorrow. After that I'm going to stop doing Airdrie for a whilst. Going to concentrate on Hearts and creating the base of next years season articles in my general sandbox for may. Will finish Airdire in a few months again feel I've spent to long on it for now so much more I want to do. EdinburghWanderer10:37, 22 January 2012 (UTC)
very odd to confirm players out on loan but not where. I was going to have a look at club web sites tonight to see if anymore transfers. Expect there to be more over the next few days with the window closing on Tuesday. EdinburghWanderer10:26, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
told you the whole debate about the first division would come back to haunt us again. Getting sick of it. I can see it been taken off from the list at some point but all you have to do is look at todays scottish papers to see how much coverage it gets.EdinburghWanderer16:22, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
I really hope so don't have the stomach for another argument half way through the season. Cowdenbeath will be interesting I'm half hoping Ayr get relegated so its only one semi pro team so this does not happen again.EdinburghWanderer17:02, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
Found this source that shows top scorers and attaches him to Brunswick City[2]. Thats 2 each. Really not sure to be honest my gut feeling would be Brunswick.EdinburghWanderer19:13, 27 January 2012 (UTC)
Notice of discussion at the Administrators' Noticeboard
Hello. This message is being sent to inform you that there is currently a discussion at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you.
The only reason i never notified them was because they weren't around. You should comment at the main project as well there is a clear and utter grudge here. EdinburghWanderer12:27, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
It just annoys me that they don't accept he is socking and attacks aren't merited. If he wanted to be a good editor then fine but he does not want to contribute. I strongly feel there is another account out there he is editing from.EdinburghWanderer13:06, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
Just to let you know after today I'm taking at least a week off from editing main space. I cant deal with this anymore whatever the outcome its up to other editors to decide whether it stays or not i give up and to be honest I'm no longer caring what that outcome is. Ill work on next seasons articles in my userspace and leave others to it i think thats the best thing i just can't deal with all this. If the division is removed then no new articles but it won't effect previous years and our main body of work isn't effected.EdinburghWanderer16:49, 28 January 2012 (UTC)
Goodbye for now
Thanks for your outstanding work over the last year. Regretfully I have decided to retire for the time being I have asked an admin to put a enforcer on the account. That has been set at three months. I may return after that but at the moment its unlikely. I hope you will look after the project and feel free to take stuff from my project page. My health is my main concern I just can't deal with this anymore I worked so hard to do things for this project but I am left alone to defend it and take the flac for it. I cannot do this anymore. Goodbye for now. EdinburghWanderer03:21, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
Reply
Thanks but I'm sick of being the only one that stands up to people like this. Nobody is bothering to reply to him or deal with him other than me. Its clear that no one feels merit in his attempts or they would reply. Its not on though I'm sick of being the only one to deal with these things. People all say to me here that they agree on my page but they just don't do anything. I welcomed the fact he is now back to using his own account but he's just done what started it all at the last time on the pro page and I'm not reverting him ill speak to him calmly but not doing any more. Its time every member of the project actually to say what they feel rather than letting me take the flac for everyone . i don't care if they see the opposite to me but just stand up for themselves if they feel the league should be removed then all they have to do is say it. Please don't reply at my page just reply here if you want to. Im considering staying but will not create any new pages for football for the time being will probably concentrate on vandalism.EdinburghWanderer20:17, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
Edinburgh I know you have felt somewhat isolated in dealing with the situation, but I only would have gotten as worked up as you. I would have felt the same way as you did & that wouldn't have be beneficial for anyone, I'm not going to waste my time arguing with a vandal. If an admin takes the current case seriously, they will see that PG is acting in the same manner as when he was original banned & the case will boomerang. I won't be online for the rest of the night & I don't suspect I'll be making to many edits tommorrow. I'm busy in real life but i'll drop in to comment at WP:ANI. ★☆ DUCKISJAMMMY☆★ 23:02, 29 January 2012 (UTC)
Notice of discussion at the Administrators' Noticeboard
Dumbarton have signed David Gray. Now Dumbartons announcement only mentions Airdire but when you look at airdires page it says he joined kitsap pumas. Their site does mention him. It's original research but do you think it's safe to presume the transfer is from Kitsap. EdinburghWanderer13:39, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
Sorry should of made it clearer. Kitsaps page lists David Gray under their squad profiles. I mean Airdires season page shows he joined kitsap and I then checked Kitsaps site. EdinburghWanderer14:08, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
Id be very surprised if the player is real to be honest or at the very least he is non notable. Ive checked all the places i can think of and cant find a trace. Not much you can do at the moment to be honest other than what you've done after that he should be warned when he does it. Eithier adding deliberate factual errors or adding of unsourced material. If he doesn't stop then AIV but that would be further down the line. Ill keep and eye on it.EdinburghWanderer22:41, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
I think AIV would block them if thats the only edits they are making and all are unconstructive but they would have to have plenty of warnings.EdinburghWanderer23:09, 31 January 2012 (UTC)
The user name rang some bells so i had a wee look at the history of the Ayr United F.C. to see if i could find anything. Found two User:Cammy ayr utd1910 and User:Cammyaufc1910 the latter created the Ayr Academy page previously so thats why he recreated it. Im a bit surprised to see them having multiple accounts as the original is a productive editor. Im assuming good faith and thinking he got locked out of the original and created another but not sure why there is another one as well. The two articles about the clubs seem ok to me and i don't know enough about songs to answer that but i cant see it being notable maybe have a look at Wikipedia:Notability (music).EdinburghWanderer00:02, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Definitely no tech issues at all. The thing is i can see no reasons for socking the first edited from november 2009 to June last year. The second was created in July last year and the third in January. The first account has a few deletion notes but nothing really bad. Other than being locked out the first account and creating another i cant see any reason for it but then that doesn't explain the third. How come every time a new editor comes along who has some productiveness like the first two articles always has other problems. Would be nice to have some new editors helping out. The song i doubt will pass let me know if it does would be interested. EdinburghWanderer00:38, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
On an unrelated note been meaning to ask you about this I've noticed on several english season articles the use the option on Template:Football box collapsible to show that a match has been postponed. Do you think this is something thats worth doing.EdinburghWanderer00:44, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Thanks for that. I was just wondering how i was going to get the original info. Will have a look tomorrow night once I've recovered from being frozen at the Hearts game in the afternoon.EdinburghWanderer01:23, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
I have asked an admin active in that area if a formal spi is needed or if they will not check because they are stale. I'll let you know what he says. EdinburghWanderer14:38, 15 February 2012 (UTC)
He's begun using his second account again, its seems to me that he is being productive. However he is breaking the rules, maybe a friendly word of advise would suffice, but I think it would be best coming from you as I have nominated some of his articles for deletion & he mayn't be very receptive towards me. ★☆ DUCKISJAMMMY☆★ 22:36, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
I've left a temp plus note on all three. Hopefully be the end of it. All he has to do is use one or declare the others as part of the main but three accounts is a bit much. See how it goes.EdinburghWanderer23:13, 26 February 2012 (UTC)
Socks
Hello, and thanks for pointing it out, I've reported this one as well. The main problem with Mr Latham when he was active before, was that he edited from an IP range that couldn't be easily blocked, so every time one set of socks were blocked, he promptly created some more. Rather hoped he'd got bored with it... cheers, Struway2 (talk) 14:12, 5 February 2012 (UTC)
Sorry to hear that but I'm really glad your back you've been missed. I think I've done all the season articles bar two which I'm going to do now from last night. If i have missed any will catch them at the weekend.EdinburghWanderer18:29, 23 February 2012 (UTC)
Im wondering if you know where i could look to try and get the international section sorted. Ive found a ref to say he played nine times for the full irish team. But cant find anything for the under 21 stats or the under 20. Its the only unreferenced part of the article. Doing my head in. Finally getting around to getting the Hearts players up to scratch.EdinburghWanderer19:53, 27 February 2012 (UTC)
Yeah and the SFL fail to show who scored two of the goals in the Clyde game [3]. Not going to get many season articles done today as going out. Will get a few more done today and the remaining tomorrow. EdinburghWanderer17:30, 3 March 2012 (UTC)
It came up with a warning but let me move it ok. Just deleted the redirect I made and redirected yours. Did it completly stop you might be something to do with autoconfirn status but wouldn't of thought it would be but thats all I can think of. EdinburghWanderer20:06, 3 March 2012 (UTC)
Grant Adam
I am asking several people whether or not they think the draft i have User:Edinburgh Wanderer/Player Sandbox would meet GNG. I think he is notable but GS thinks is possibly notable for one event although there is sources for two events. Would like further input before I do anything. EdinburghWanderer13:11, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
it was just a general piece on him think about the under 21s the chances of me finding it are slim given I've spent two days trying to find it. So it needs to be judged without it. He is notable I've no doubt in my mind but is it just for one event or not. I'm non overly bothered eithier way but don't want to waste any more time on it if he dosent until he makes a pro appearance. EdinburghWanderer13:50, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
Just to clarify the scotsman article isn't another event. There are two as I see it the two articles that talk about the under 21s and the others about the court case and being dropped from the under 21s. Just read what you asked properly. There are also plenty of sources about him and his brother but not counting those as are trivial. EdinburghWanderer14:24, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
I agree his career hasn't come to much yet. Playing for the under 21 doesn't make him notable automatically I think the herald articles and the sun article are good for that and the court case has received far more coverage than you would expect. His brother doesn't really come into the decision as it's trivial mentions of his family. I think the amount of hits you get on him show he is a notable figure but I fully accept we could be limited purely to one event although I think it's two. There are articles that scrape GNG far less than this one but I'm not moving it unless others think the same. I've got a feeling most people will say borderline not really wanting to move it in that case. EdinburghWanderer14:52, 6 March 2012 (UTC)
Annoying all the same. Have kept meaning to start the postponed games but never got around to it just never had the time. Thanks anyway appreciate it.EdinburghWanderer21:27, 7 March 2012 (UTC)
tut tut. Oh your a google boy. Ill stick to my Mac and good old Safari. Must be having tech problems. Do you get a error message saying site unavailable. Thats what i got yesterday.EdinburghWanderer19:49, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
Hello there and thanks for the invite. Since you also do not live in Scotland I shall feel no guilt in accepting and I'll go onto the task force page shortly. My team in Scotland is St. Mirren as I am of a Paisley family but I'm afraid my first love in football is Liverpool, especially the legendary Scot Bill Shankly whose article I'm steadily expanding. Thanks again and all the best. --Brian (talk) 08:54, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
Photo
Ill do that in a wee whilst no problem. Wouldn't of thought that would be allowed but it appears it is. Just reading one of the Kilmarnock players dad had a heart attack in the tunnel at the end of the game.[4][5].EdinburghWanderer19:01, 18 March 2012 (UTC)
Ive added Arlan Kadina Mptata as a transfer to dumbarton's page but cant find what club he has come from so have left it blank for now. Hopefully the SFL will have an article soon. The weirder one is Tony Bullock for Livingston. Until two weeks ago at the latest which was the last time i looked he was listed as both a first team player and a coach. Ive looked again and he been taken off both lists. Tried to look closer at it and apparently last september he retired as a player[7] to focus on coaching. Thisdoes not explain why he was listed as a coach and a player until two weeks ago. Im assuming he has left the club but cant find a further mention.EdinburghWanderer20:11, 11 March 2012 (UTC)
found that as well the source about bollan can only think he quit after the sacking. I check the website fairly regularly so can only assume he was registered in case of emergencies. Rather odd livi are normally really good at announcing people leaving even coaches. Will need to add him as retired. Hopefully will be able to find something at some point. Rather frustrating. Hopefully dumbarton or the sfl will mention where their player has come from. That and with the Hamilton website being down has made it a rather frustrating day. Couldn't find a dob for a new article had to get snowys help didn't realise the BBC did player profiles only one of 4 that had the players dob. Im finally back on the Airdrie seasons again. Just need to add player stats to the last one and create two more and will be all done. Hoping to get it done this week so probably won't be doing much else. Finding soccerbase to be even more unreliable than I first thought at SFL level. EdinburghWanderer00:50, 12 March 2012 (UTC)
I would say Cracovia if thats the last club he played for before joining. Wiki article needs changed if its wrong. Also Alan Combe has joined Greenock Morton[9]. He's not had a club as a player since August 2011 other than as a trialist. Would need a footnote to be added to the transfer page i would think.EdinburghWanderer16:49, 16 March 2012 (UTC)
Cool i never had a close look at it. Did you get a reply about Bullock. Just working on the last Airdrie season will be glad when they are all finished.EdinburghWanderer18:27, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
Thats great. The last season is the one I'm not to sure of, the match reports are contradicting in places but I've done it the best i can.EdinburghWanderer19:16, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
Just reverted and reported them. They were past their final warning anyway. I was watching the Hearts match at the time. Hopefully someone will, I've removed him of the pages anyway. Just to say not going to be around as much this weekend if you are would you mind doing the SPL or first division ones, i should have time for the rest.EdinburghWanderer00:34, 22 March 2012 (UTC)
League Cup final
Sorry Duck I wasn't at it. If I do find any pictures I'll upload them though. The article is looking in pretty good shape and I'll try and do a bit more work on it over the next few days. I think we could probably get it up to GA standard relatively easily. Adam4267 (talk) 15:54, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
Hey Duck, I hope you don't mind but I removed the under construction template. I just don't think it's necessary seeing as the page is currently still of interest and it doesn't really look good. The final was also just yesterday so people probably wouldn't expect it to be fully up to date yet. Adam4267 (talk) 18:49, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
I'll do that section now then. And I'll try to expand a little on pre and post match. I also added the honour and info to all the Killie players earlier. Adam4267 (talk) 18:57, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
I've done the report now but just kept it simple so feel free to add any sources or change anything. I would say don't worry about the lead for now because it is supposed to reflect the article as a whole and I think that it is generally easier to write once each section is filled out so the appropriate weighting can be given to everything. Adam4267 (talk) 19:38, 19 March 2012 (UTC)
Hey Duck I'm about to go off and might not be on again tonight. If you could find a source for the cn in the Route to Final section that'd be great. I haven't been able to find anything for it and it would be helpful. Cheers Adam4267 (talk) 17:14, 20 March 2012 (UTC)
It seems that all references to his birthplace are from his profile on Sky Sports so I don't think I'll be able to prove it seeing as all sources go from that. Harry 350 (talk) 03:51, 25 March 2012 (UTC)
Hi Duck, the two IP's you reverted on NI born footballers are the same editor, I think you might have guessed it already. He has many blocks on different IPs, mainly I have to saw on my request for BLP catergory violations, adding "people of Irsh decent" or the such without a source and removing, as you have found today, "footballers from Northern Ireland" and similar from some. He has tried to kill off Paul Greens international career several times one example, and on Stephen McPhail removing "people from Westminster". He hops around, I have tried this time to reason with him, but it seems to fail, if I dont spot it feel free to throw a more severe vandalism warning at him, he definitey knows what he is doing is wrong at this stage, December 2011 and last week. Cheers. Murry1975 (talk) 17:49, 31 March 2012 (UTC)
![[6]](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Scottish_League_Cup_final_programme_2012.jpg){kind=link}